Northern Rhodesians WorldwideSM
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Message Board
Linda
Craig is still working on that part of the names directory.
Who are you harassing and I'll pass the message on for you?
Keep your eyes on this message board - I'm just waiting for the clock to tick over 1.00am here when you will see a brilliant contribution I'm waiting to post on the new months message board, sign off and hit the sack.
Arthur
Arthur Steevens [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Stockport, United Kingdom
Monday, June 30, 2003 at 23:55:17 (UTC)
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Craig: (or anyone who can help me)
Okay, what am I doing wrong here? I was trying to surf the Names Directory, but when I click on the link, all I get is the list of people who have been updated today, this week, or have bad addresses. Is there a new way to get into the directory itself now?
Oh.. I get it. I'm blacklisted. ha! ha! No, seriously.
Linda Hayes (née Dore) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Austin, Texas, United States
Monday, June 30, 2003 at 23:06:39 (UTC)
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Bill,
Vikram Solanki was born in Udaipur, India, but was brought up in Wolverhampton. So the African connection is not there! He may have relatives in Zambia! Last zambian born player to play for England was Neil Radford.
Ayub Ismail Zumla [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Manchester, United Kingdom
Monday, June 30, 2003 at 10:59:12 (UTC)
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Bill,
Yes, there were, and still are, a number of Solankis in Zambia. I think Vikram was born here in the UK and his parents are from Africa. Will let you know when I get some response about where exactly.
Ayub Ismail Zumla [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Manchester, United Kingdom
Monday, June 30, 2003 at 10:54:36 (UTC)
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Recent Site Updates:
June 30th, 2003:- Redesigned the detail pages in the Names Directory so that they are easier to read and conform to the new template.
- Added the list of people that each person is looking for to their detail page in the Names Directory. Remember to log in to remove the names of people you were looking for once you have found them.
- Added some default text which is displayed only if you have not entered anything in the "Narrative" field of your entry. The "Narrative" field is a free-text area where you can add any additional information you wish. The wording is designed to encourage those who have been economical with information about themselves and their time in Northern Rhodesia or Zambia to be more forthcoming.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Monday, June 30, 2003 at 08:19:31 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S!
This is only germane to the GNR in the context of the memories it evokes from life in Northern Rhodesia...
Few Americans get my accolades. But the one who died today does. I loved her comments about her ageing and passing:
"I'm what is known as gradually disintegrating."
"And do you know, they'll miss me, like an old monument. Like the Flatiron Building."
And for all the crap people say about the golden age of being old... I can surely attest to her comment about disintegrating!
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper
Founder of the Great North Road website
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Monday, June 30, 2003 at 07:59:36 (UTC)
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One & All
Vikram Solanki - Member of the English Cricket team that beat the Boks yesterday - Is he a relation of the NR Solankis?
This family were eminent bespoke Tailors to the Copperbelt community.
Bill Hunt [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Widenham, Natal, South Africa
Sunday, June 29, 2003 at 17:56:00 (UTC)
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Mwizenge,
Sorry I took so long to respond. I have not been on the site for quite a while.
I am not too familiar with AIDS issues but my sister is a medical scientist and she has done a great deal of research in the area. She got her Ph.D from London University in the mid 1980s. Her first two degrees are also from London, at Chelsea College. For the doctoral degree she examined the connection between diabetes and strokes.
Until she left for the regional health quality control centre in Uganda she was head of the Tropical Diseases Research Centre in Ndola.
I'll pass on your enquiry. Better still, I'll give you her e-mail address so you can communicate directly.
Chisanga Puta-Chekwe [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Sunday, June 29, 2003 at 03:27:23 (UTC)
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More Books
Since they were mentioned recently, here are links to some more books.
Don't Let's Go to the Dogs Tonight by Alexandra Fuller:Mukiwa: A White Boy in Africa by Peter Godwin:Books bought through these links contribute a small (tiny!) referral fee which goes towards the care and feeding of the GNR.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Saturday, June 28, 2003 at 07:06:54 (UTC)
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Thanks Kristien.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Saturday, June 28, 2003 at 05:57:25 (UTC)
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"Tick Bite Fever"
From Amazon.com in the US.
From Amazon.co.uk in the UK.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Saturday, June 28, 2003 at 05:53:17 (UTC)
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Heather - and Everyone
Have just done the homework I should have before giving you the Tick Bite Fever by David Bennun book news!
Printed in paperback by Ebury Press ISBN 0091886899
On Amazon co.uk there is a rating of 4 stars out of 5 and its listed as a biography, 320 pages. Price if I recall correctly is £9.99
Regards
Kris
Kristien E. Massie (née Mostert, formerly Van Woenssel) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
United Kingdom
Friday, June 27, 2003 at 12:05:06 (UTC)
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Mwizenge,
Thanks for your invitation to a very worthy cause, however I unfortunately have already made other commitments for the upcoming weekend. I heard that President Mwanawasa is in town for the U.S.-Africa Business Summit this week. Will he also be at the fund raiser at the Embassy on Saturday? Good luck with the fund raising.
Good work Dave, and the GNR management team in running a great site!
Chandru Krishna [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Rockville, Maryland, United States
Friday, June 27, 2003 at 00:03:11 (UTC)
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Kris
Unfortunately no joy so far - there were two Martins listed in Cove Bay .... whoops, have just spoken to the second lot and their daughter is an only child called Susan - they are related to the first one Alexander. Back to the drawing board - next stop, butchers. Am sure they are a close knit community so will take my bottle of chi, chi, chianti and pick my local one's brains (figure of speech). He has been in Bucksburn since I got here and is quite a character.Actually went one step further with the joke and openly displayed a sign during the BSE scare which read "The only mad cow in here is my wife".
Sarky, I know Management in the Workplace has come on in leaps and bounds over recent years but Viagra strategically placed on workdesks? Really think they are trying to tell you something, doll. They say it is a great stress reliever though and that a known angler stops lying about the actual size of fish caught!
On a happier note (read into that what you will), my e-mail is now up and running again so will not use the Board, under any circumstances, for idle chatter (yeah, right - tis half the fun). So anyone that knows me, please send me an E (qualify that one as well Main, mail).
Tara
Gill
Gill Main [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Aberdeen, Scotland
Thursday, June 26, 2003 at 19:51:42 (UTC)
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Chandru,
Thanks for your comments on the ZADOVATE web page and nshima. The name has been changed to “Zambia Knowledge Bank”. The "bank" will soon be soliciting Zambians for information and knowledge on all aspects of Culture and Technology in Zambia with the idea of publishing a one big volume of “Encyclopedia of Culture and Technology in Zambia”. I notice you live in Maryland. I want to let you know I will be entertaining banquet guests at the Zambian Embassy this Saturday night June 28 in Washington, D.C. This is a fundraiser for Zambia Orphans of AIDS. This variety show that I have been doing the last 8 years includes my performance of traditional Zambian drumming, dance, and story telling. You might want to attend as an antidote to home sickness. I don’t want you to experience sticker shock but the fundraiser is $50.00 per dinner plate.
Ayub, Chisanga
I tried to get on Ayub’s brother’s web page but could not get on it. I am very interested in the immune system and genetics in relation to AIDS and troptical diseases. I have been reading extensively about HIV-AIDS and the immune system over the last 18 years. I wrote a 30 page paper in 1999 on the scientific aspects of HIV-AIDS in Zambia/Africa. If you would like a copy of the paper, I can e-mail it to you and may be you could give me some feed back. Since it is written by me, a sociologist, its very readable. It addresses some of the very controversial aspects of the AIDS science that no one wants to talk about for reasons too complex to describe here. I will be revising the paper soon to include research data I collected recently on AIDS last August in Zambia.
Yunus,
I am so thrilled you know where Mussadique Kadodia is. Tell him this is Jacob Tembo a classmate in Form I and II at Chizongwe Secondary School. Let him know that Abdul Munshi is still in Lusaka. I was with Ben Kalinda and Jeremiah Nyirongo last August in Lusaka. Tell him that if he is still as “crazy” as he was, I don’t want him visiting me. I hope he will have a good laugh about this.
Mwizenge Tembo [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Virginia, United States
Thursday, June 26, 2003 at 15:37:52 (UTC)
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Hi All
Just noticed another new book we may find interesting. "Tick Bite Fever" by David Bennum - afraid I dont know who the published is, but it is in paperback.
Seems the author spent his formative years in the 70's in Zambia and Kenya and survived to tell the tale.
Regards
Kris
Kristien E. Massie (née Mostert, formerly Van Woenssel) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
United Kingdom
Thursday, June 26, 2003 at 14:32:22 (UTC)
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To all New Comers to the GNR
Every couple of years, I make a couple of announcements about the start and history of this website. It did not always have a message board. But it was one of the earlier private web sites on the Internet. I started it whilst working at a software company in the San Francisco Bay Area in California at the height of the boom times of the IT industry.
Since there wasn't a message board, I divided the site up into a number of rubriques. This constituted a suite of pages, much like a book is a suite of chapters. I called this the TGNR web suite (THE Great North Road).
If you are new to this site, you might not know about all the different sections. I urge you to look around, there is plenty more to see than just the message board. You might discover a little hidden notice about the first announcement of this site. I created the site because I did not want to see it become like a certain other ex-pat site, which had sadly declined into a viscious trail of graffiti and insults. This is one reason why today, I and the management team try very hard to keep that sort of thing from happening on this site, which has always, for the most part, been free of vitriole.
Probably the part of the site that I am most proud of, is the interactive map of Nkana-Kitwe. This is a vector graphic display. Not a bitmap. So the resolution of lines and other geometry NEVER deteriorates into pixels. This is high-tech stuff, folks even today! Some people have mentioned that they cannot get it to display. There is no reason why it should not display if you follow the directions. The WHIP! Plug-in has been renamed as the Autodesk Express Viewer. If you have Autodesk products like AutoCAD on your computer, you probably have this already. If not, the download does not occupy much space. If you do not download this Plug-in, you will not see the Nkana-Kitwe map. I recommend that you do download the viewer, Autodesk is the most reliable computer software company in the world. That is an undisputed fact, I promise! And not just because the Founder of Autodesk, fled the US for much of the same reasons as I did, I promise!
Many things that come up on the message board have been often discussed before in the past, but we can't always expect new comers to know this. However, remember that this site is not new, and that most topics about Zambia probably have been touched on by someone on this site in the past seven years of its existence.
Many members of this site have been members since its inception. They are still with us, and are as such considered much appreciated as venerable founding members.
Please take a look around. Notice all our links. Try some of them. The collections of items and photographs are considerable as well.
Much of this stuff will be in a better reorganisation when the new site is up and running.
Much of the site is new since it was first started in 1995/6. This is largely due to the incredible efforts of Craig Hartnett, Arthur Steevens, and Heather Chalcraft, the brilliant management team that keep this site running. What is truly impressive about this team is that it straddles three countries: Canada, England, and Zambia --- something I am also very proud of!
Take a look around and welcome!
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper
Founder of the Great North Road website
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Thursday, June 26, 2003 at 13:36:12 (UTC)
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Hello to all ex residents of NR/Zambia, Viv and Frank Yoxall, now live at : 7 Nottingham Court,
St. John's
Woking,
Surrey,
GU21 8TH.
Our home Telephone number is 01483 822453
Viv's Mobile phone No. is 07734840501
My direct Office No. is 01737 647986
My Mobile No. is 07740 065125.
We would love to hear from any old friends who may read this. Margaret and Peter Riley, Peter Bill, John Watt, Dot Hughes, Malachy Doherty, Jim Griffin, Aurther Chatterly, any old Moth's, Alec and Maureen Chisolm, and a whole host of friends, and people whom, I cannot recall names of if you remember us please make contact.
All the Best to all, Viv and Frank Yoxall.
Frank Yoxall [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Woking, Surrey, England, United Kingdom
Thursday, June 26, 2003 at 06:15:15 (UTC)
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Geoff Rawlinson
Thanks for the map of Kalulushi - you must have been reading our minds. I have discovered 4 other people from Kalulushi all living within a 4 km radius of each other in Auckland: me, Brian Ledeboer, Thea Grobler & John Payne. We met up recently & were trying to picture the streets and where everyone lived. Our challenge now is to remember the 'old' names. We probably need Gordon Garlicks help with that!
The rugby pictures also brought back some memories:
79 - hidden at the back - Bob McGuire, far right standing - Mike Thomas. Sitting - Brian Neirynck, Tom Serratt, ? Bob Bigmore, Neil ?.
Front: ? Alan Armitage
81 Back: John Tustin, ?, Mike Thomas, ?,?,? Alan Ryan, ? Steve Stone
Front: ?,?,? Alan Armitage, Callum Richards, ?,?
Geoff can you remember the names of the others?
Patsy Davies (née Rosson, formerly Rixom) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Auckland, New Zealand
Thursday, June 26, 2003 at 05:12:47 (UTC)
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Philip,
Alexandra Fuller's book has been discussed here before and there's nothing wrong with recommending a book. As you say, it's not about the war and it is actually almost completely apolitical. For some reason I took from the title and the blurbs I had read about it that it wasn't, and so I was initially not very interested, but Heather kindly sent me a copy and it's an excellent read.
Although the complete Names Directory is not browsable at the moment, you are correct that she is not a member.
Speaking of removing fillings with toffee, I once removed an entire molar with a chocolate eclair. Not sure if it's a recommended dental technique, but it was quite effective, although completely unintentional.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Wednesday, June 25, 2003 at 23:03:12 (UTC)
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Heather:
Quite by coincidence it turned out that George Old became related to one of my good Munali classmates, then later my father joined Rothmans and worked with him there as well. If his contact details are readily available to you, I'd appreciate it if you could email them to me.
Phillip:
Alexandra Fuller's book was great, I finished reading it earlier this year and I believe Linda was lucky enough to attend a book signing a couple of months ago. Another book that I read later and that brought back memories of growing up in Southern Africa is "Mukiwa" by Peter Godwin.
Barrie:
Yes, sadly Dr. Barnard passed away in Cyprus at age 78 of an asthma attack on September 2, 2001.
Chandru Krishna [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Rockville, Maryland, United States
Wednesday, June 25, 2003 at 22:18:46 (UTC)
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Phillip:
What a wonderful story and how it conjured up the Rhokana pool as if I were there yesterday. I could picture every little detail you described, from the Swiss Roll towel and costume, to the feeling of the hot cement after getting out of the pool, to the toffee in a million pieces. What a great story teller you are. Keep them coming! It took me a while, but when I was around 12 or 13, I was able to build up to being able to swim the width of the pool completely under water. It seemed like half way across the ocean as I reached the other side, lungs bursting for air, but I wonder just how far it really was. Yes, that diving board felt like it was in the clouds. I only jumped off it once. The soles of my feet stung for hours, but earned me bragging rights with my older sister.
Linda Hayes (née Dore) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Austin, Texas, United States
Wednesday, June 25, 2003 at 21:28:30 (UTC)
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Hi
I heard this in a pub recently and modified it slightly to add the corporate "tongue in cheek." I used it in my tenth ATB-B speech at Toastmasters and received a successful evaluation (any other Toastmasters out there?)
I left out the last paragraph as I felt some may find it offensive. Some reading now may also find it offensive, best suggestion is not to read it.
A CORPORATE TALE
It was the eighth day in the Garden of Eden. Management had been busy the previous week and had rested. The Boss, who the night before had dreamed up some exciting ideas for the future, wanted to share these with the staff. Being IBM trained, he decided to call a meeting and made his way to the boardroom cloud, summoning the troops by voice mail en route "Adam, come here."
Adam, who had been ignored up to now and relished the chance of languishing in the power, glory and luxury of the Executive, came running, calling eagerly "yes Boss, what is it? What can I do for you?
The Boss replied, "Things are soon going to be different around here and as part of your change management training, I am able to offer you one of two choices." Adam, keen and raring to be of service asked "What is the first choice?" The reply was exciting. "You can have a penis, so that you can urinate standing erect." Adam, who was tired of squatting and embarrassed by the fact that he dribbled on his ankles, immediately took up the offer and the promised penis grew between his legs.
Not knowing better how to use it, he began filling and emptying his bladder, over and over again. He sprayed everything in sight, grass, trees, shrubs and he even hit a bird in flight, once, when he squeezed very hard. This was great but as the day wore on, he found that water did not taste that good after all and, as the fruit had not been on the trees long enough to rot and ferment into alcohol, there was nothing else to drink. The novelty wore off.
Remembering that there had been a second choice, he made his way to the Executive floor, and asked, "Boss what was the second choice?" The growled answer "Multiple orgasms" left him unmoved as he had no idea what an orgasm was. Nothing daunted, he decided to examine the rest of the garden to see what else management had been up to, in case he should need to form a union to protect his rights.
Wandering around and marveling at Managements ingenuity, he came upon an apple tree and found on it a big, shiny, juicy, green apple, a meal in itself. He went to pick it and stopped when the Boss yelled "Adam, don’t pick the apple." The penis story still fresh in his mind, Adam knew who was in charge, and left it.
The next day Eve arrived and whilst Adam was showing her around, they came again upon the apple tree. The apple had now grown bigger, a meal I itself for two and was red, luscious and juicy looking. Eve went to pick it and again the Boss intervened "Do not pick the apple" and realizing he would never have the same control over Eve as he had over Adam, thought to explain "If you pick the apple, you will start the biggest plague the world has ever seen"
Neither knowing what a plague was, they disobeyed him, Eve picked the apple and it was eaten with gusto, pips and pulp, the sweet juice dribbling down their chins.
That night the two went to bed, to be awakened early in the morning, just after sunrise, by a knocking on the door. They were certainly surprised, as they had walked the entire garden the day before and found nobody else. They had also checked with Security and had been told that no new access cards had bee issued. Furthermore they had been told in training that it would take nine months to reproduce, although they had not yet covered the module on the physical requirements. Confused and a little frightened, Eve told Adam to get the door, which he opened cautiously and found before him, a dark skinned man, dressed in ragged clothes , who wrung his hands and smiled invitingly as he asked "EschoosememyBaasieIamlookingforwek."
A couple of days later, the Boss, looking for Eve came upon Adam and asked him where she was. Adam replied that she had gone to the river to bathe and was reprimanded by the Boss saying "Adam, I did not want this to happen, now the fish are going to smell!"
Owen Thomas [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Henley on Klip, Gauteng, South Africa
Wednesday, June 25, 2003 at 20:42:44 (UTC)
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STILL GROWING UP IN NKANA/KITWE CONTINUED
It was about this time in my life (5-6 yrs), that my brothers thought it was time to teach me to swim. This happened at the Rhokana mine swimming pool and was achieved by throwing me into the deep end.
I remember hot summer days waiting on the steps with your towel & costume rolled up like a swiss roll for the gates to open and my brothers pushing me under the turnstile so I did'nt have to pay. As you entered the gates one had that beautiful four to five tiered fountain in front of you, gushing water in steps. On the left was the boys change rooms and on the right the girls. Boys under a certain age (I think it was 16) has to change in the very first change room on the left as you entered the passage, and had wire cages for your clothes, with a bench along the wall. The older boys and kids with their parents used the main change room, which had private cubicles in which to change.
I know there were showers, but can't remember
where they were, besides as a kid, you had been in the water all day, why would you want to shower?
After changing into your costume, you had to go through the footbath with mauve coloured water (I think it contained condies crystals) to get to the pool. I also remember you were not allowed back out the main entrance to get to the pool.
Once outside by the pool, you would claim your spot with your towel on one of the concrete pathways (older boys & girls sat on the grass). This was done so that when you came out of the water one could lie on the wonderful hot cement.
Now with the sixpence I saved by ducking under the turnstile and the sixpence I had as pocket money, I could buy a slab of Wilson's toffie (the one you smacked on a hard surface and broke into a hundred pieces and which pulled your filling out) from the tuck shop, behind the paddling pool.
I remember Pop Patrick was the caretaker/life guard. A wonderful old man who had lots of patience & time for kids. He taught me for my basic life saving course. The only rule which Pop had and was quite strict about was that if you went onto the top board (remember the huge diving tower), the only way down was over the edge into the water. We as kids used to sneak up there to suntan and when Pop wasn't looking sneak down the stairs again, to second top. I had no trouble jumping from there. But on one occassion, unfortunately for me, we were caught up there by Pop and had to jump. I think it must have taken me about a half hour to get the courage to take the step of the edge and jump. I must admit it cured me from top board until I was much older.
Can anyone remember the height of the diving board? Felt like a 100 feet!
It was interesting to think back on the fumes from the smelter which used to settle over that area in the afternoon, depending on which way the wind was blowing, and used to burn your lungs and eyes. If that happend today I reckon that the plant would be shut down immediately, there are more than likely some of us out there who suffer respiratory problems which can be directly linked to breathing that smog. (Maybe we have a case for compensation).
Cheers for now
Regards
Philip Pain [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Eshowe Kwazulu Natal, South Africa
Wednesday, June 25, 2003 at 20:37:37 (UTC)
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Greetings to All,
I have just had a book returned to me which I bought at the beginning of this year.
I would like to recommend this book to anyone who grew up in the Federation and knew what it was like to grow up there.
The book is called " DON'T LET'S GO TO THE DOGS TONIGHT" AN AFRICAN CHILDHOOD.
The author is Alexandra Fuller who was born in England, and she moved with her family to Zimbabwe and then to Malawi and Zambia. She now lives in Wyoming with her husband and two children.
I must stress that this is not a book about the Rhodesian War but a book about growing up in a time and place, which has left indelible memories in one's mind. I believe this is one of the reasons a lot of us have joined the G.N.R.
Alexandra's book ends at a place called Mkushi which I take to be a place very close to NDOLA.
I went through the names directory to see if she was a member, because with her story, I was positive she would be there. But alas NO!
To the founders of the G.N.R. please understand that I am not "PUNTING" this book, but feel it is compelling reading, in the sense of wanting to go back to those times which we all enjoyed, good or bad.
Regards to all
Philip Pain [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Eshowe Kwazulu Natal, South Africa
Wednesday, June 25, 2003 at 19:30:47 (UTC)
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Elspeth
Sorry I haven't got round to e-mailing you but I look forward to your call when you are here in the UK.
Phillip
Great stories - please keep them coming!
Jacqui Milward (née Lackenby) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
London, England
Wednesday, June 25, 2003 at 18:34:32 (UTC)
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Hi All
The talk of curfews brings to mind one evening when we decided that we could beat it without any problem, little did we know.
I am not sure if this was the same curfew that Heather is talking about as I believe there were further curfews after we left Zambia in 1978. This occurred during the first that I remember. At the time we were living in Roan Avenue, Kabulonga and had very good friends just over the road from us. When it first started we were very good obeying the curfew but as it dragged on, it was probably only a couple of days, and our social life was being disturbed we decided that as it was only over the road we would go over before the curfew and then just roll the car back, without lights, to get home. Why you may ask did we have the car; well we had two young children at the time and the amount of katundu made it impossible to just walk over.
We had a great evening; there were also another two couples there who were going to stay with us that night as they lived too far away to just nip home. If my memory serves me correctly the electricity had been switched off during the hours of curfew as an enforced blackout so the evening was spent playing cards by candlelight.
The time came when we were to go home, probably about 1am as we had work the next day, and we piled kids and katundu into the car leaving the adults to walk over. I started the car and set off towards the gate and a male voice from the right says something like "What are you doing, where are you going". My first thought was to tell him to mind his own business and then it dawned on me. Living next door was one of the Presidents advisors who warranted an armed guard from what looked like the paramilitary and it was he standing there sub machine gun slung over his shoulder. I got out of the car and pointed to our driveway across the road and said that that was where I was heading. I said I would not switch on my lights and would only be on the road for about 30 seconds. No chance, there was a curfew and he was authorised to shoot anyone seen breaking it.
There was nothing for it but to return to our friend’s house and try and find place to bed down for the night. This resulted on us sleeping on the floor of the lounge but to be honest I don’t think we managed to get much sleep. At 6am when the curfew was lifted we were ready to nip across the road get showered and changed and head off to work. We didn’t try that again but did have a couple of more evenings where we arranged to stay over.
The curfew did not last that long and after a while the enforced blackout was lifted, they no longer switched the electricity off, but there was still a blackout in force. I heard it said that, during this time, Lusaka seen from the air looked like a black hole. All the farming community that surrounded Lusaka were still showing lights but the centre was completely blacked out.
Hartley Heaton [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Binfield, Berkshire, United Kingdom
Wednesday, June 25, 2003 at 12:17:47 (UTC)
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CHANDRU,
I was very sorry to see in your posting that Dr Christian Barnard had passed away. He was one of my heroes. I dont know how long you have been lurking out there, but at the risk of boring everyone who already knows, I had a heart transplant in November 1996, and so far so good. I really cant understand how I missed that news as I visit my local transplant clinic every month and no one has menyioned it. KEEP LURKING AND POSTING.
REGARDS Barribee.
Barrie Braidford [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Newcastle upon Tyne, England
Wednesday, June 25, 2003 at 07:19:16 (UTC)
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Hi,
Am going to the UK next week and haven't been able to contact the following friends to meet over there:-
Maeve Bryne - email address has changed
Alison Brooks
Esther "Weller"
John Brake
Jacqui - Wayne has given me your phone number- will give you a ring when I get there.
Am I allowed to bring biltong into the country - vacuum packed Woolworths biltong and dry vors? Apparently there are signs all over Heathrow to say no meat!!
Happy Birthday Chris
Heather C - I "think" David and I are definites for the "Livingstone Lark" - am just waiting for him to confirm flights through "his" travel agency - he has voyager miles he wants to surrender!! but he's so busy at the moment - and I'm getting very frustrated.
Any news from the Arnold / Cantley / Coventry / Collett families from Mazabuka?
Am moving offices tomorrow so won't have a computer -if anyone can help me - could you possibly get back to me today - thanks so much.
Regards,
Elspeth Lloyd (née Robertson) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Blairgowrie, Johannesburg, South Africa
Wednesday, June 25, 2003 at 06:26:24 (UTC)
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Chris Cantrell
Happy Birthday
Chandru
As far as I know George Old is still here.
Yes, I was resident in Lusaka in the 70's and remember well the day you mention. It was the start of a lot of problems for the farming community, many of whom were abducted by Nkhomo's men whilst they were trying to plant their crops. My father was the chairman of the Commercial Farmers Bureau (now the National Farmers Union) at the time and the farmers all came to him for help. Often he would arrive home at night to find someone waiting for him and he would have to go back into town to get the police and army moving and this after he had just spent the day in town sorting out such problems instead of attending to his farming operations. Luckily no one was killed or seriously hurt.
It was a pretty hairy time and I remember one day getting a phone call at work to say that I was to stay there and that my dad would come in and escort me home. I was only 18 at the time and there had been a number of people beaten up in the streets and they were concerned about me making it home safely.
The curfew was only introduced about three or four months later but we didn't let that stop our social lives. We would all meet at the Longhorn Restaurant which you may remember had an enormous closed in parking area. With us would come whatever was needed for sleeping and we would party and then retire to bed either in our cars or where ever our mattress landed in the car park.
The demolition of the Kazungula Ferry also affected us. My father had some polo ponies coming up from South Africa, so my brother flew down, loaded them on the train and was to travel back on the train as far as Botswana, when they would be offloaded and my father's trucks would pick them up there and take them across the pontoon and up to Lusaka. The Rhodesians put paid to that plan, but my brother did manage to get authority for the horses to carry on their journey on the train but they were not happy to let him travel with them. He eventually persuaded them and they were offloaded in Livingstone and moved from there by truck.
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Wednesday, June 25, 2003 at 05:57:20 (UTC)
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Hello everybody,
After lurking around as a silent reader, I decided to join the GNR. I grew up in Zambia from 1968 to 1981, living in Ndola from 1968-1971 (Kansenji Primary school) and Lusaka from 1971-1981 (Chelston Primary and Munali Secondary). Then I moved to the States for my university studies and settled here.
I was curious to see if anyone knew of the following people I knew in Zambia:
Teachers at Munali - David Johnson (geography) and Bournechastel (French)
Robert Chiluwe - head of one of parastatals (building supplies?) in the seventies
Dr. Hussein - doctor at Chainama Hills hospital and friend of the late Dr. Chris Barnard, the South African heart surgeon.
Mr. D'Cruz - a veterinarian in Lusaka with many daughters who attended the Dominican convent school
Mr. Natesan - a meteorologist in Lusaka
George Old - production manager at Rothmans and an avid golfer.
Mwizenge
I visited your Zadovate web page and the Zambian food page brought back memories. Unfortunately for me Nshima was an acquired taste and I was never able to acquire it, but I definitely would go for the chicken and other meat Ndiwo, it looks delicious!
Linda
Your discussion of Kaputula (shorts) from a couple of months ago amused me. I remember the word, though it was the Nyanja version (Kabudula). Certainly not to be confused with Kabwalala which I think means "thief" !
Heather
Did you live in Lusaka in the late seventies? One sunny morning I was sitting in class when we began hearing "thump" sounds coming at intervals from a distance. We went out for our mid morning break and when we returned our teacher told us that the Rhodesian airforce was bombing guerilla camps in the Lusaka area. Shortly after, a dusk to dawn curfew was declared when the Rhodesian commandos began launching raids into Lusaka.
Ayub
Sorry to hear about the crime situation in your part of England. Here in the States the crime situation varies according to income level of the area (safer in middle and upper class areas and worse in poor inner city areas). Also people are generally tolerant maybe because most everybody is either an immigrant or is descended from immigrants from diverse groups, however there are occasional outbursts such as after 9/11 and Pearl Harbor.
Jill
Your mention of overland travel brought to mind two books I read recently, "Dark Star Safari" by Paul Theroux and "Adventure Capitalist" by Jim Rogers, both giving good perspectives on African countries by two very recent travelers. Good for armchair travelers though not as much fun as the real thing!
I often wonder why I think of Zambia so often even though I have not been back for years and years. After reading Mwizenge's and Doug's posts from early May, I better understand why.
Cheers
Chandru Krishna [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Rockville, Maryland, United States
Wednesday, June 25, 2003 at 00:27:34 (UTC)
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Dawie
In accordance with the Headmaster's instructions, I have had a good look at your map. I'm impressed. Only one place that you left out - Luangwa was known as Feira. Well done.
I think Nchelenge was called 'Fort Rhodesia' (I'll have to check, one of the towns up there was known by that name) but I'm talking about somewhere round 1907/8 so I don't expect that we have many members who will remember it by that name. And then of course there is Lusaka which was originally called Lusaakas.
I'm also surprised that you didn't add Kansanshi near Solwezi - must have been a moment of weakness.
I also notice a very prominent name in the Northern Province - Mumpolokoso which has me totally confused. We have a Chief Mumpolokoso, but none of my maps show the town Mumpolokoso and it is too far west to be Kawambwa and too far north to be Luwingu. All my maps show a big blank there although it looks as though it is close to Mbulumotute Falls. Perhaps it is a mission or Chief Mumpolokoso's village? I just can't understand why it would be given such prominence.
Then there is another mystery and perhaps Doug Grewar or Johnny Green can help me. Where was the town of Fife? Is it what we now know as Nakonde (immediately opposite the Tanzanian town of Tunduma) or is it further south. I've been trying to find out exactly where the Stevenson Road ran and no one seems to be able to tell me where Fife was.
Craig
I had a chat with the Smart Sarky one and he told me what OSF stands for. Far too rude to talk about it here. And no more talk about ZX 81's - I still have mine tucked away in a cupboard somewhere for the day Paul Golson and I are going to start a computer museum with all our computers. Between the two of us, we have two ZX 81's and every model from there upwards until about 1992. And all working too. Just imagine!
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Wednesday, June 25, 2003 at 00:20:56 (UTC)
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Arthur,
Ho, ho, ho. Tell me, Mr. Abbreviation, what OSF stands for in your sarky world.
Thanks for making me look for ZX Spectrum stuff. Just wasted more time than I'm going to admit trying to get to level two of "Miner ..." ag, nevermind.
ZX Spectrum directory
The World of Spectrum
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Tuesday, June 24, 2003 at 20:52:50 (UTC)
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Oh Craig
Watch your spelling - that's Diaper-com.
Arthur
Arthur Steevens [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Stockport, United Kingdom
Tuesday, June 24, 2003 at 19:36:45 (UTC)
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Heather
Yeah, I've heard of them all.
- Sun - Big shiny thing in sky - not seen in the UK
- Unix - Unisex underwear - I think - check with Dave
- HP - A Sauce - perhaps you don't get it over there?
- Sunview - When there's no clouds in the sky during the day
- VAX-VMS - I think this is a sooped up vacuum cleaner
- Supeminis - common in the 60's, very small mini-skirt or belt. Not the Mini Cooper variety
- Solaris - sun cream stuff
- OSF - I'll leave you to guess what that means - something to do with Southerners
- Motif - An up-market tattoo
My first computer was a top of the range Sinclair Spectrum ZX - I think it had 18kb of RAM (or was that the size of the hard drive) and a very rubbery keyboard. I still have this, one day it will be a collectors item I think. With this model you got a set of leads so you could hook it up to your state of the art monitor (a Colour TV) and load the software from your cassette player in a matter of only half an hour or so. My favourite was space invaders, still is. Everything had to be typed in DOS to programme it.
Philip
Good stories keep them up please. I think your experience about not being able to go out because your pants and underpants were taken away was really funny. Must have happened to one or two other boys in Nkana because I still think it goes on today, a sort of longing for the old days by certain "Old Foagies" residing on the Continent (a scrubbland off the Kent coast).
I also remember that attempted confining to the house during the mid afternoon, I was always told it was because I would get sunstroke, polio, smallpox or some other dread disease.
I lived close the pump station near the Kafue in the mid 50's - I never heard of any kids involved in getting shot dead, but I do recall some kid being taken by a croc. But hey that was just everyday stuff.
Arthur
Arthur Steevens [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Stockport, United Kingdom
Tuesday, June 24, 2003 at 19:12:45 (UTC)
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Dave,
As Arthur will tell you, I was in nappies in the late 80s. However, in 1989 I was connected to a sort of internet (called Dialcom), but not the Internet.
Image Resizing in IE
If Internet Explorer is resizing images to fit your browser window, an icon with four arrows should appear when you hover your mouse pointer over the image. Click this and the image will go to 100%.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Tuesday, June 24, 2003 at 17:20:21 (UTC)
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Dawie
How can I scoff at things like Sun, UNIX, HP, Sunview, VAX-VMS, Superminis, Solaris, OSF, Motif - I've never even heard of them? Have you Arthur??
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Tuesday, June 24, 2003 at 16:46:25 (UTC)
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Arthur
Thanks for the hint on stopping sizing of the image to the browser window. You know I had a look at all of those options in the Internet Options dialog suite, and I can't believe how complex it has gotten! The English used is also so jargonised that surely the average man in the street will not understand this. At least, I have decided to find some documentation to help me decipher what the English means for many of these options.
It has come to pass that for us who first came to use the Internet, browsers, and the world wide web in the late eighties are now regarded as "Old Foagies"---and that this new generation---the Arthurs and Heathers of the world---scoff at the older generation's quaint references to things like Sun, UNIX, HP, Sunview, VAX-VMS, Superminis, Solaris, OSF, Motif, and other anachronistic references. I assumed Craig was there with me in those days of old!
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Tuesday, June 24, 2003 at 14:04:36 (UTC)
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Arthur
I had a brief scan of the map this morning and picked up a couple of things (not errors, more queries), but no time to deal with them now (deadlines again). I'll get to it later today.
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Tuesday, June 24, 2003 at 12:30:56 (UTC)
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Correction
To stop Windows re-sizing images when you click and open a link:
Go to "Control Panel" open "Internet Options" and then select the "Advanced Tab" - navigate down the menu to "Multimedia" and de-select "Enable Automatic Image Resizing"
I only have XP and W2000 Professional - the same option is probably possible in 95/98/ME
Arthur
Flounder of the day.
Arthur Steevens [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Stockport, United Kingdom
Tuesday, June 24, 2003 at 12:28:40 (UTC)
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Chisanga,
Thanks for ur message. Prof Ali Zumla did gain the Windrush 2003 Professional of the Year award on Saturday.Staff at the UTH Research Centre in Lusaka are over the moon! Prof Chintu and Dr Mwambwa are walking with smiles on their faces today! Will pass on your felicitations. Rageh Omar won the 2003 Media award at the same ceremony..for his BBC coverage of the Iraq War. Chisanga, Windrush was the name of the ship that brought the first immigrants from the West Indies to the UK.
Ayub Ismail Zumla [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Manchester, United Kingdom
Tuesday, June 24, 2003 at 12:14:00 (UTC)
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Dave et al,
You can stop Windows re-sizing images when you click on a link thus:
Go to "Control Panel" and click on the "Advanced Tab" - navigate down the menu to "Multimedia" and de-select "Enable Automatic Image Resizing"
When you do this the image will appear as intended so no need to have Photoshop etc to view the image in it's correct size.
I have spoken with Craig who has investigated the copyright issue on the map and he tells me we are in the clear to incorporate it into the GNR Maps section of the site.
I will work on that this week.
Heather,
Please can you check the map out for us and let me know if Dave has missed any of the old names - probably not, but just in case.
Johnny,
The map is available now - go back to Dave's posting made at yesterday at 20:18:20 UTC and click on the link. He has not used the Fish Eagles head icon, that is incumbent to the GNR site. The map is currently on Daves own site as a temporary measure.
I didn't go near a supermarket on my way to work but I passed a butchers shop so I bought some bullocks sweetbreads, I already have a bottle of rum. One of the blokes working here also left some Viagra tablets lying about on his desk. I will cram all this stuff in a jar when I get home, with an airtight lid and I will post it over in time for your next visit to Gill Main. Let me know if this works for you both better than the prunes.
Arthur
Arthur Steevens [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Stockport, United Kingdom
Tuesday, June 24, 2003 at 12:09:02 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S!
Oh, I forgot... if you download the map, you can look at it in its proper size in an application, such as PhotoShop. If you just click the link, then it displays in your browser, scaled to fit. Thus you can't see detail. You should save the JPEG to disk and use an application, like PhotoShop or Windows Picture and Fax Viewer (which comes with your Windows XP Professional installation). You might have some other application to view bitmaps. They should all do the job.
If you have something else besides Windows XP, I don't know what you would use.
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Tuesday, June 24, 2003 at 09:40:06 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S!
To all the people who thanked me for the map, you're welcome, and it was very kind of you to thank me! What manners, almost as good as us Continentals!
If you scroll down this message board, and find the posting in which I link to two modern Zambian maps, the first link is the original source of the map I used. Arthur, you know how to query the message board to see the URL. Please, do not use this map on the web site as a permanent feature unless we get permission. You know the deal.
About Pringles. I am SO relieved you agree with me Arthur. When they came out in that country I used to live in previous to here, I tried them: I had a knee-jerk reaction and spat them out. Now I notice here in Nederland, young kids, especially at the bioscoop (this is REALLY what the cinema is called in Nederland: this is the original source of our "bioscope"), kids buy tubes of this vile slurge and eat it during the show. Not as bad as in that place I used to live in, where they buy DRUMS of viscious popcorn sprayed with petroleum fake butter-product! I am saddened to hear that Antwerpen is the source of Pringles. Next time I go to the Holy City of Antwerpen, I will find the factory and I will destroy it. WE SHALL CLEANSE THE WORLD!
I will stop referring to myself as the Flounder. Sorry!
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Tuesday, June 24, 2003 at 09:34:07 (UTC)
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Gill Main - Thank you for giving me a real good laugh at the possible phone message scenario! Brilliant!!!
And thank you for helping me in the quest - I live in hope - as I said Adele had her handbag stolen in Zim and with that all her contacts. I strongly believe she still owns her house in Cove Bay and hopefully the tenants will be good enough to respond.
Thanks again so far ...
Kris
Kristien E. Massie (née Mostert, formerly Van Woenssel) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
United Kingdom
Tuesday, June 24, 2003 at 08:58:41 (UTC)
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Dave thanks for a prompt answer to my request for the map.
Arthur when will it be available for the masses, I would hate to miss it, any one contemplating pickling figs the spirit was white rum, and the reason they had been in limbo for all those years was that I was a little wary on trying them, but then came along a perfect guinea pig to experiment on and after a reasonable wait to see if she fell down I then indulged my self they were mushy steric, I would imagine a period of around a month would be long enough to impregnate the figs with this delectable taste of course I would imagine that you could use the booze of your choice for indulging your own palet, happy pickling Johnny.
PS They are better than pickled onions.
------------------------
Johnny [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Scarborough, United Kingdom
Tuesday, June 24, 2003 at 06:58:42 (UTC)
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Gill Main (and anybody else who's interested)
You could never keep a secret!!!!!!!
Yes, I got married (for the third time) to a lovely lady called Margaret. We met at work in May 2000 and have lived together since Sept 2001. We got engaged on her birthday last year in April and married this year on my birthday, also in April. Easier to remember aniversaries this way.
I did not do it secretly, just couldn't publish it as I have not had internet access since the end of March. I have been waiting all this time for the sperm counters (that's Telkom translated from Afrikaans to English), to install an ISDN line. They finally did it and lo and behold it went down on Sat morning. Seems somebody burned the cable somewhere down the line, but its back up again.
Margaret is Greek Orthodox and because the SA govt. does not recognise weddings in the Greek church, we have to have a civil wedding, performed 30 April and will have a church wedding with reception on 06 September. The timing is to allow for ID books to be changed and passports issued. Then its off to Greece, Cyprus, Switzerland, Greece and home. She is a divorcee with two kids. You will have to wait till September for photies.
This brings the number of offspring I am responsible for to 8. Two stepsons and a daughter from wifey 1, a daughter and twin boys per wifey 2 and now hers, boy and girl. Ages range from 6 to 28. Just to keep the tradition, we will have another.
There have been a number of concerns about the age gap (my 51 to her 28) and we finally concluded that age is a number, maturity a value. She also feels happier being an old man's darling rather than a young man's slave, which was her previous situation.
I have left formal employment and am starting my own business. Begin trading next month. Hope to make lots of boodle and diddle the receiver. Having been in Corporate employment most of my working life, he has taken a great deal from me. Now its payback time.
BTW, I have some photies of the Muf Flying Club and some of the environs from the air. I will publish them once I work out how to submit them. These were taken in the 70's and show the extensions to the Clubhouse. Will be interesting to compare them to an earlier lot I saw which were taken before the extensions were done.
Nuff for now
Cheers
Owen Thomas [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Henley on Klip, Gauteng, South Africa
Monday, June 23, 2003 at 22:08:57 (UTC)
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Dawid
Thanks for the cool map ! - the Northern Rhodesians amongst us can now pinpoint the place names Heather uses when she travels around Zambia.
Maybe we can incorporate the map into the GNR proper? Craig can we do this? It would be a shame to lose it and will be so useful to the GNR members who are yet to join.
I have an e-mail today from Ted Mills in Capetown - a 1960's map of the Federation is on its way on a CD rom. I look forward to that one.
And since I've been nice to you so far Dave, I'd better now throw in a raw prawn or two.
1/ Where did you steal the map from ?
2/ Those Pringle things you mentioned a day or two back - I also think they're disgusting, you would never guess where those on sale in the UK are made - ANTWERP ! Did you also say that this was a cool city ?
3/ Why have you stolen my Flounder title ? Have you ever caught one yourself ? Next time I catch one I'll have to throw it back now, it will remind me of you too much. I just cannot eat ugly fish.
Naatchies
Arthur
Arthur Steevens [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Stockport, United Kingdom
Monday, June 23, 2003 at 21:59:36 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S!
Wow that was an EASY win... you had all day to beat me. But here you go, here is a map of Zambia with the old names added in red uppercased italic characters. Please note the most important one is the biggest one.
This map will be available at the following URL for a limited time of 48.723 hours. It will then be gone. It is large. I cannot keep it on my server forever.
Map of Zambia with old places in red by Dave Cooper with love
You're welcome.
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Monday, June 23, 2003 at 20:18:20 (UTC)
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MORE MEMORIES OF GROWING UP IN NKANA/KITWE
Shortly after I was born my sister Lena got married to Joe Windell and moved into a mine house at 59 Central street and they often looked after me when the need arose. One of those occasions was when my parents received a telegram from family in Kimberly to say that my Grandfather was very ill and that my parents should come as soon as possible.
So train tickets were booked and my parents went off to South Africa, leaving me in the capable hands of my Sister and Brother in-law.
Those of you who can remember, it was quite common in those days, that when you went on leave you got some family to move into your "leave house" and look after it while you were away.
Now, the people who lived next door to my sister were away on leave and a family with a boy and girl my age were looking after their house. We soon became friends and spent alot of time playing together, but in the afternoons after lunch I had to go and lie down till 3 o'clock. It did'nt take me long to sneak out the house when everyone was asleep to go and play next door. Well my sister and brother in-law soon devised a plan to keep me in my room. They used to take my pants and underpants away from me, which not only embarressed me, but kept me in my room (come to thnk of it, I should have tried that stunt on my two boys when they were young). No, maybe not! As I still occasionally have dreams of being in public without my pants on.
Maybe one of you on the GNR went into the field of Psychology and might be able to comment on the possibility of my childhood experience having a bearing on my dreams or maybe it is a macho thing.
FRIDAY THE 13TH
When I was still very young, an incident occured which affected my eldest Brother Alf for a long time.
On this particular Friday the 13th, It may have been a Good Friday as no one was at school, my brother and a bunch of his friends went down to the Kafue River, at the end of Central street for a picnic (near the pump station).
Unfortunately one of the youngsters took a pistol with him and the guys were taking turns to shoot across the river. Sadly, while the gun was being passed to someone else it went off, fatally injuring one of the boys. By the time help was arrived the boy had died.
I don't know who was all there, other than my brother, but maybe someone out there might remember the incident. It must have been in the early 50's.
After this incident my brother developed a phobia and would worry himself to death on a Friday the 13th. This continued until his son was born on a Friday the 13th, and being a fit and healthy little boy, seemed to have cured him.
Cheers for now.
Phil
Philip Pain [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Eshowe Kwazulu Natal, South Africa
Monday, June 23, 2003 at 20:11:40 (UTC)
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Lynne,
Sorry to hear my suggestion didn't work. Good luck with the rations. :)
Betty,
Please contact me directly and tell me what you are trying to do, as you haven't provided me with enough information here.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Monday, June 23, 2003 at 20:08:12 (UTC)
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Geoff and Kerry Rawlinson, well strike me down with a feather the good ole GNR has done it again. Kerry, never knew you got married in Z-land and have tried to contact you also Tracy as my niece, Debbie Gilges who also went to St Andrews, always asked me if I knew where she ended up, they were good friends.
Geoff, had Les my sis look at the photies, I remembered another two faces and was pointing at, in my words, the little short Londoner bloke (sorry Dave Driver if you are reading this). Also the sixth guy along in the first photo, the tall one, rather dishy looking - still don't have a name but as a rather impressionable young gal at the time certainly recall a bit of drooling, who is he?
Kris Massie - looked in the phone book and got all excited as the second A Martin listed lives in Cove Bay so phoned but alas an ansaphone. Left a message with my telephone number but in my exhuberance (it's great getting mates back together again) might had muddled things up and left a missive like, "Hello are you Adele, do you have a sister called Diane, if so Kris Massie would like to butcher you". No, don't worry, only joking. Just hope it is the right family otherwise the 'Bobbies' might come calling.
Doug - Johnny knows how to (eat and drink at the same time) - when I was in Scarborough he produced a rather evil looking jar and suggested we taste the contents thereof. I was dubious but having lived in Z-Land have always maintained I will try anything once. It was figs that had been soaked in spirit, no - not meths- for 20 years!!!! Great stuff.One day my liver will find its way home. No seriously, was very good.
My outgoing e-mail is still not working so...
Suzie Matwetwe in NZ - will catch up very soon - you are elusive. I hate time differences. Every time I phone you - ansaphone, every time you phone me, ansaphone.
Sparky - you missed the plot My Dear - one month too late!
Ricky Rosewarne - why didn't you tell me earlier that you are a computer buff??? HELP.
Gill Main [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Aberdeen, Scotland
Monday, June 23, 2003 at 19:35:18 (UTC)
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Dear Craig Hartnett,
Hi, this is Lynne Pain, Phil's wife. I would like to thank you for your words of encouragement to get Phil to spend more time with me instead of the GNR, unfortunately they fell on deaf ears!!!! By the way I had make all kinds of promises to him for his password so that I could thank you! (HE! HE! I won, but for all the time he has already spent on the GNR, there will be broken promises!!)
Thanks again for your attempt, but it did'nt help! I will have to resort to rations!
Cheers
Lynne
Philip Pain [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Eshowe Kwazulu Natal, South Africa
Monday, June 23, 2003 at 19:24:59 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S!
Well I calculated the time it was taking to look at all the stupid maps posted by loosers around the world, and figured I could do the map that Johnny wanted quicker than trying to locate a colonial map of NR.
I can do this because I located a modern of Zambia, and I have the Atlas for Rhodesia & Nyasaland which was issued to ALL of you by your Northern Rhodesian government when you were sent off to school.
I have made the map and I will post on my server, and you can download it. If you ask me how to download it, I will tell you use FTP at your command line. That's how I do it.
I am waiting for Craig to OK an upload of this 1 MEGABYTE JPEG file (did you read that? one megabyte is what I said... are you ready for that?) to my server located in the FABULOUS and WONDERFULLY PERFECT country of CANADA!
Stand by...
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Monday, June 23, 2003 at 14:21:45 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S!
Thought I would check on the progress of anyone else finding maps of Northern Rhodesia and Zambia. I see nothing yet from anyone else. But if you are searching and taking up this challenge, stop looking for Zambia. There are plenty. I have these two so far:
Modern map of Zambia, no. 1
Modern map of Zambia, no. 2
Both have been reported on the GNR before. So my search for them was a re-invention of the wheel and wasted time.
Actually, there IS an old colonial map of the Federation on the GNR. It was one of the first images I posted on this website. I won't tell where it is. You can find it. But I will say that the detail is not good, since I scanned it at 72 dpi, and it was a mineral map, and so shows not all the towns. But if you are a REAL Northerner, you will instantly recognise the book it came from, because it SHOULD have been in your satchel everyday.
Now bad to search for colonial maps... unless you get one before me.
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Monday, June 23, 2003 at 13:37:34 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S!
Given the fact that some people work at jobs and then come home and work on the GNR, and others have more time on their hands, like myself for example... I suggest a challenge:
I bet you can find a map of Northern Rhodesia with old place names and a map of Zambia with new place names on the World Wide Web.
Then you could print out the maps, or display them in an editor such as Photoshop and make the notations yourself!
So, I jumped to it a few seconds ago... and what would I put in the search string, folks? Why of course, let's start at www.google.com with something like, er, let's see, "colonial map of northern rhodesia" perhaps? Hmmmm, over 10 pages of hits. Sounds promising. The second string should be easier, since maps of modern Zambia should be everywhere.
But I get distracted... I find something which Craig suggested we look at some months ago. We all remembers this, right, since we all pay attention when Craig speaks. And we give him the respect to check out the sites recommends. At least I think we do. The site is about maps of colonial Northern Rhodesia... alas, no town names, but I decide to investigate further. This is called surfing, folks.
The site is WHKMLA Historical Atlas, History of Zambia. I will leave YOU to find the URL (you can do it, I promise). So I decide to find out what and who is WHKMLA, as I notice it links to the GNR! This is so typical of surfing... link to link to link to link...
WHKMLA is produced by the Korean Minjok Leadership Academy... an academy (whatever that is) in the south Korean countryside. It has 200 students with a faculty of 50.
Unbelievable, the GNR is used by this Korean countryside academy to teach people about Zambia.
Think about this for a minute. All I was doing was hacking away at homemade HTML because I had a motorbike accident and was laid up in my bedroom and my company was telling us the new technology of HTML produced things called Web Pages which took benefit of Tim Berners-Lee's invention called the World Wide Web. And I wanted to find some lost friends from Northern Rhodesia!
This is knocks me out, folks! Maybe not you. Anyway... back to the maps...
You can beat me at this? That's the challenge.
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Your Friendly Flounder
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Monday, June 23, 2003 at 12:37:21 (UTC)
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I am still having problems accessing the Names Directory despite the message that this function was programmed into the site during the week of 12 May. Is this a general problem or is the problem at my end?
Glad to hear the numbers attending the Livingstone Lark are increasing. Would love to have gone but it wasn't to be.
Betty Mahady (née Horn) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
United Kingdom
Monday, June 23, 2003 at 12:28:20 (UTC)
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Arthur when you have recovered from your latest maps excercise woul'd it be possible for you to obtain an old map of NR nothing elaborate ,and put the new names along side the old names of places that have changed there names after 1964 just pen the new names in so we can orientate ourselves again when Heather goes off on her rambles, I canot remember now what they call Fort Roseberry or Fort Jamieson but I think this could be due to senile dementia rather than memory loss. Cheers Mate Johnny.
Johnny [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Scarborough, United Kingdom
Monday, June 23, 2003 at 11:50:49 (UTC)
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GNR Members
It has been brought to my attention that I failed to mention Dave Cooper as a member of the GNR Management Team in my most recent posting.
No slight was intended and I apologise for any hurt caused to Dave who I have always recognised as the Founder of this website.
Ian Singer
Ian Singer [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Livingston, West Lothian, Scotland
Sunday, June 22, 2003 at 20:20:13 (UTC)
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Northerners !
As promised the cleaned up Kalulushi Map.
Original Map Courtesy of Geoff Rawlinson
Please bear in mind that although tiny in comparison to the one on my PC, the image is quite large and will take time to download for those of you who are on dial-up internet connections.
I managed to squeeze it down to around 480kb. This is a bigger vesion than the one I first posted on this month's message board on the 7th June, which is still available in it's original version. The new Kalulushi map will be added to the GNR maps section later on.
All the maps I have dealt with over the last few months will be available on a CD ROM at a date sometime in the future. These are high-resolution versions suitable for printing. I'm just waiting for one or two other maps to turn up...
Geoff - my thanks to you on behalf of The Great North Road and it's members for sharing this with us all.
Arthur
Ian
Fantastic work.
Bet you're glad that's over, and you're welcome.
Without your help and encouragement I probably would have given up a few days after I started helping out on the GNR, so it was payback time. Only glad I could return a favour or two, you have a brilliant site.
Hope you can get some good sailing in now - and don't forget to take the wife.
Arthur
Arthur Steevens [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Stockport, United Kingdom
Sunday, June 22, 2003 at 17:52:41 (UTC)
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GILL MAIN
Thank you for your congrats... Paudie is recovering...
Hi to all the GNR's and anyone who took the time to surf my new website ~ over a 100 of you ~ thanks, I appreciate your interest.
Yes ~ Ian Signer ~ I echo Ali ~ 3000 scans! You must deserve a medal!
Sue Forde [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Midleton, Co. Cork, Ireland
Sunday, June 22, 2003 at 16:09:51 (UTC)
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Hi all
I would just like to say that Ian singer is a legend.......
Ali
Ali Key [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Perth, Australia
Sunday, June 22, 2003 at 14:28:44 (UTC)
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Hi All
I am pleased to say that all thirty Northern Rhodesia Journals are now available. I haven't counted the pages exactly but at a rough guess I would say 3000 which should keep you as busy reading them as it has me scanning them!
I would like to record my gratitude to my parents, Mona and Marshall Singer, Angus MacDonald, John and Paddy Fleming and to the Great North Road team, namely Arthur Steevens, Heather Chalcraft and Craig Hartnett.
These are the folk who donated or lent precious copies of the Northern Rhodesia Journal so that the world could enjoy them. Thank you!
Now I want to work on things that don't have 100 pages each! I will do some tidying up of the NRJs - some of my early scanning efforts could do with some work but for the moment - that's all folks!
Regards Ian
Arthur - I'm away this week but I'll get in touch soon about returning the GNR copies thanks again! Ian
Ian Singer [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Livingston, West Lothian, Scotland
Sunday, June 22, 2003 at 14:23:36 (UTC)
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www.nrzam.plus.com has been updated.
These three issues have been made available through the generosity of the Great North Road website: http://www.greatnorthroad.org
Added Volume IV - No. 5 - 1961
The Whale Headed Stork or Shoe-bill: Legend and Fact
Old Mkushi in 1912
Sunken Lakes in the Ndola District
The Evacuation of Kasama in 1918
A Note on African Taxes and Tax Stamps
Company Days
The Feira Affair, 1917
A Note on the Forts of the Eastern Province
Wild Life in Northern Rhodesia
Kanyanta and His Times
Notes: Luangwa Valley - West Side. /New contributors to this number /R N (Bawana Bob) Stewart /Nkala: An abandoned mission on the Kafue Flats /More about Jack Merry /The oldest railway engines /Trading in the Lukanga Swamps /The Nyasaland Society /Where was Fundu?
Lusaka Natural History Club
Correspondence: Lake Lusiwashi and Sumbu /Josselin de Jong /Pioneer Farmers in the Northern Province /Chinungu: War Time Boma /Thornton and Rumsey of Mbesuma
Book Reviews
Added Volume V - No. 2 - 1962
Kafue-Namwala in 1912 Part II
Livingstone to Fort Jameson before the Great East Road
Local Bird Photography
Trading on the Luapula 1900-4 Part II
The Development of Medical and Health Services at the Roan Antelope Part 1
"It's Funny but it's True" - Lusaka becomes the Capital
The Baldwin Diary, Part 1
The P.E.A. Rebellion of 1917: The Diary of Rev. Father Moskopp, S.J.
History of the Northern Rhodesia Rifles
Changes in the Structure of African Commerce, Lusaka
Notes: Camels in Northern Rhodesia /
First records No.18: The first woman, the first child and the first honeymooners to visit Victoria Falls. /Notes on an old whisky bottle. /Livingstone to Kasama and back, 1917-18. /New Contributors to this Number /Some waterfalls in the vicinity of the Kalomo River. /Low stone banks or walls in the Mazabuka District.
Correspondence: Chapman of Chansa /Erratum: Wildlife in Northern Rhodesia /The history of Abercorn /Traction Engines /Philip Jelf Comments /Errata /
Book Reviews
Publication Fund
Lusaka Natural History Club
Added Volume V - No. 3 - 1963
The First Copper Mines in Northern Rhodesia, Part I
Mpesenii and the Exploration Companies, 1885-98
Jack Cowie . . . and a Number of Others
The Baldwin Diary, Part II
Kapembwa
The Development of Medical and Health Services at the Roan Antelope, Part II
Mutende: The Newspaper for Africans
David Livingstone: A Chonology
Trading on the Luapula, 1900-04, Part III
Notes: The level of Lake Tanganyika /Joseph William Sharratt-Horne /First visit of a Governor to Lealui, Barotseland /Some waterfalls in the vicinity of the Kalomo River - map omitted from Vol. 5 No. 2 /New contributors to this number /Livingstone Town Services: The Beginnings /H J Van Breda: Some reminiscences /First records - No.19. The first farm and the Walker Family
Correspondence: Mounds in the Kalomo and Mazabuka Districts /Kafue-Namwala in 1912 /Andrew Law and W.B. Knight /More about Fundu /Tanganyika: a postmark /Paramount Chief Lewanika /Fort Young and Fort Patrick /Was Cinunda's the first Fort Jameson?
Book Reviews
The Publication Fund
Northern Rhodesia Society: Statement of Accounts
Lusaka Natural History Club
Regards Ian
Ian Singer [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Livingston, West Lothian, Scotland
Sunday, June 22, 2003 at 14:07:10 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S!
A number of people on this website and elsewhere not on this website have told me that they will be in Amsterdam this summer. I invited them to give me a ping or ring when they are here. I always follow-through with hospitality, and I usually spend time with the people, offering as much of a tour of my neighbourhood (you can do that here, it is not a housing tract in a suburb that looks the same as any other suburb), and you can walk (motor cars are not part of life in Amsterdam---they figured out how to do this a long time ago)... so walking, albeit difficult at time for me (for those of you who don't know me, I have a serious motorbike injury), is what we do, or we hop a tram, a boat, a bus, bicycle taxi, or we sit on the bank and watch the boats on the canal outside my door... it is summer.
However, you need to give me some notice when you are here. If you are here on a Friday, it is best to alert me (about a week before) of when you intend to ring. I am strict with my timeliness, as the Dutch are not. I give people a buffer of 10 minutes before and after the time agreed, then I consider them non-shows. Being that this is an interesting place to live, I try not to remain in the flat for longer than is necessary... I take my breakfast at a local café, I wander the ancient beautiful streets and steegen, I watch the colourful parade of people enjoying themselves... it is summer. I do not sit besides the telephone waiting for calls. I refuse to get a mobile phone---that is too yuppy for me! You have to ring me on the landline at an agreed time.
I am in Amsterdam until 9 July, when I change to the complete opposite of what life is like in Amsterdam---I find myself in a sea of cars and suburbs and malls and freeways and cars and cars and cars and traffic jams and cars and freeways and suburbs and cars---Los Angeles.
Hope to hear from you soon...
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Sunday, June 22, 2003 at 11:40:27 (UTC)
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Hello all GNRers
Sending you all a very big long lost mooooooo!
I was woken up this warm Sunday morning at 7.30am with the loudest and longest claps of thunder I have ever heard in England - the window of my bedroom shook (no comments from you Johnny!) What it did do however, was jolt me back to my roots in Africa. It is only there I have experienced that volume and duration of thunder! The kind that starts with the loudest crack then just rumbles on and on, fading into the distance. Anyhow, I lay there for a while thinking of those 'first rains' after the long dry season and 'suicide' month. What joy, we would just run and stand outside with our faces to the sky and get soaked. I also recall jumping in and out of the storm ditch full of rushing water. When I think of it now, could quite easily have been swept away under the culvert that went under the drive and be lost forever! But we were tough or was it stupid? The Rapids was another one, it's okay to swim here as the crocs don't like the rocks! Hmmm, soon found out why, as body surfing over them was great fun, albeit painful at times.
Anyhow, those thoughts drew me to the GNR message board, so I've have spend a drizzly Sunday morning trying to catch up with the wonderful stories and pictures being posted - think I'll probably need the whole day! But chores call and golf this afternoon, so better not linger too long.
Keep up the good work everyone, take care and big hug to you all.
Moimoo Fivecows
xxx
To my wonderful sisters Theresa, Linda and Glenda - love you lots.
Moi
Moira Fenwick [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Dorking, Surrey, England
Sunday, June 22, 2003 at 09:24:15 (UTC)
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ARTHUR,
thanks a million for the pictures, a total supprise. A couple of years ago when my mom passed away at the age of 91 I asked the family to keep a big box old photos that she had for me, sadly this was not done and I think they have been thrown away. (A lot of photographic history lost.)
It was almost a tradition that when we got together with her She loved to pull the box out and go through the photo's and tell us stories about the people and places, what made the collection interesting was that my mom had recorded the date, event and who was who on all the photo's
I have asked my sons in N.Z. to watch the message board so that they may learn a little of what it was like to grow up in Paradise. (Without colour T.V. )
Well you caught me with a sucker punch with the photo of F.K.'s school play. If the dates are correct I am in the chorus line at the back with the boys. I remember we had to sing with some kids dancing the 2nd. Minuet. Geez! real sissy stuff.
I will not challenge you again till I have done my homework .
The map of Fredrick Knapp must have been drawn around the time I started there, because at the end of my first year there all the standard 6's and above moved to KITWE HIGH. Maybe someone can tell us all why the school was eventually split into a boys and girls school with a massive fence between the schools? ( I have heard many rumours, but would like to hear from a horses mouth )
As to the spelling of our surname as Payne is another story I will share with you sometime.
Thanks a million again for the pic's, brought a tear to my eye.
Thanks
Philip
NB. Leave my spelling alone, I type with one finger and can't watch the screen and the keyboard at the same time.
Philip Pain [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Eshowe Kwazulu Natal, South Africa
Sunday, June 22, 2003 at 06:48:17 (UTC)
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Hello there,
Well there I was checking the gnr site out and in the address book I saw a name Cathy Ferris, I have been looking for the Ferris family for some 30years, you can imagine my delight when I saw this name. At first I thought no that cannot be Cathy and low and behold it is.
Roseanne her sister was at school with me and she was my brides-maid so I am really looking forward to hearing from her.
Cathy there was a neighbour of yours looking for you on the site, you must check the archives and see if you can find the message.
It really is amazing the things that this site manages to achieve.
Bye for now and have a great weekend one and all
Love Wilma
Wilma Wall (née Henry) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Almelo, Netherlands
Saturday, June 21, 2003 at 15:56:12 (UTC)
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Ayub
Ali Zumla certainly deserves congratulations. Please pass on my congrats to him. There is another Zambian at London University (Imperial College) who teaches and researches Genetics. Quite brilliant by all accounts. His name is Felix Munkonge. He comes from a line of doctors and businesspeople. Dr. Z might wish to contact him, if they have not already met.
Heather
Thanks. I have been made aware of Ilyashi.com. I have visited the site and I must say it is very well done.
Chisanga Puta-Chekwe [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Saturday, June 21, 2003 at 15:07:18 (UTC)
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Oh Oh Oh Heather Eina,
John Deere is the best tractor ever made! And you get to wear those neat green & gold windjammers with a jumping deer on them, just like the springbok team.
After doing my national service in the Rhodesian army 1958 / 59 and before going to Gwebi Agricultural college I worked for Smith and Bennet the Rhodesian John Deere agents. We used to go to all the shows and ploughing competitions and John Deere always used to flatten the opposition plowing deep and straight in the hardest soil. Case tractors weren't too bad but some of the others couldn't even scratch the surface.
Cheers - Doug - the John Deere Fan
Doug Grewar [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vryheid, Natal, South Africa
Saturday, June 21, 2003 at 11:24:09 (UTC)
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Welcome back Gill,
Was that whisky flavoured salmon or whisky flavoured biltong? No wonder Johnny is coming to visit. Now he can eat and drink at the same time.
Cheers - Doug
Doug Grewar [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vryheid, Natal, South Africa
Saturday, June 21, 2003 at 11:12:45 (UTC)
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Livingstone Lark
The numbers are creeping up slowly - 15 definites from outside of Zambia so far and an email to tell me that there are plenty coming from South Africa, but no names yet.
If you need a visa, you can download the forms here
Charlie
In my family, one does not mention the name John Deere in the same sentence as combine, tractor or any piece of agricultural equipment - I was taught that from a very early age.
I can imagine the sunburn. My dad's first combine was a little tractor drawn one with no cab and which, for the first two seasons, he drove himself - three or four weeks on the tractor from about 7 in the morning until 9 or 10 at night and in the October sun. Except of course, my father is a real farmer with a real Boere tan and used to the sun. After the third year, he bought a self-driven one with a cab, but also taught a driver to drive it and the only driving he did was at lunch and supper time when he relieved the driver.
And I think it was his third combine - my brother loaded the combine and the maize and wheat heads onto a truck in Durban but 'yena enzeela makulu mistake'- he forgot to check the height going under one of the flyovers and removed the cab. And as always, the combine arrived just in time for that years' wheat crop so they were back to no cab again.
Chisanga
There is now an online newspaper in Bemba - Ilyashi
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Saturday, June 21, 2003 at 10:09:38 (UTC)
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Geoff Rawlinson
--------------------------
Forgot to mention
Your photies - John Gregson stands out ( a couple of the other faces also seem familiar but it would have been more my sister's age group) and the fish you caught at Nkamba Bay, it is Keri Van-Niekerk (I "fagged" for her at St Andrews School in SA).
Gill Main [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Aberdeen, Scotland
Saturday, June 21, 2003 at 02:22:22 (UTC)
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Hello Peeps
An apology - have just got my e-mail up and running again after quite a long period of inactivity (well, almost - downloaded 159 messages which took forever but can't send any out) so please bear with me - still luv ya all. Unfortunately my address book has gone to that great Nigerian scammers paradise in the sky, or whatever, as I reformatted my hard drive.
Would just like to say Mucho mucho Congrats to Sue Forde, great stuff, and hope that Paudie isn't too stressed out with his studying.
Also, Owen Thomas, you sly old dog, kept your wedding very quiet but don't worry I feel no shame about broadcasting it! Photies please?
Bridget, I know my timing stinks..... has it ever been any different, remember I'm a Main. Will catch up with you later.
Debs, the biltong box is still in the back of the car - see paragraph above - guess you kinda knew that anyway - manyana, could always use the excuse that I didn't have the instructions - which is true so as soon as you e-mail them I will go into production.
Have been reading with interest all the messages about biltong. Friends of mine in Aberdeen own a fish house with a smoke room and have been experimenting with different flavours of salmon etc. Would it be possible to make, say, whisky flavour? I know venison is served up with a red wine sauce so...... - Heather is right - fatty, wet biltong was the best but owing to the demise of my teeth, will have to invest in a grinder. Uncle Johnny Green is coming to stay for a week in July so we can investigate this further - no not the grinder - he still has his own teeth!
Norman - I think the reason that people haven't sent in any photographs of the Muf reunion is because you were there..... our own resident photographer ... they don't want to put themselves to shame (eg. I have a wonderful picture of your back, the lighting is very subtle, possibly because the flash on my disposable camera wasn't working but I must admit it is one of my better photographs as I managed to capture your whole back plus head and feet in it - a veritable masterpiece for me). Did you get a list of everybody there?
TTFN
Gill
Gill Main [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Aberdeen, Scotland
Saturday, June 21, 2003 at 01:58:11 (UTC)
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Over the past 3 years I have searched for my ex school friend via various internet websites. I am pleased to say that thanks to your web site we have eventually made contact with each other. Haven't seen each other for over 35 years so lots to catch up on.
Many thanks for your members help and keep up the good work, for without this site old friend would be lost forever
Elizabeth Lawson (née Robinson, formerly Eardley) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lancashire, England
Friday, June 20, 2003 at 22:44:24 (UTC)
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I am looking for Debbie Clarke who lived in Ndola her brother's name was Conrad, also Sue Cartwright who was her friend.
Anyone know the whereabouts of either please let me know.
Keith Markotter [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Cape Town, South Africa
Friday, June 20, 2003 at 14:32:30 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S!
Talking about the Beatles is not entirely germane to the intent of the Great North Road website, unless of course you put them in the context of those early years on LM Radio, Springbok and in Fabulous magazine... BUT... I just wanted to tell any of you out there who are fans of this Liverpool group that the DVD, The Beatles Anthology knocked my plaid and orange and blue socks off. I got it at Saturn, the world's largest CD shop in Köln... that is a city on the Rhenus in Germania Inferior. I paid only 40 euros and there are about 7 or 8 DVDs with two 70 minute episodes on each. Many new versions, some new songs, and i found no hype whatsoever. very honest. good to hear old myths dispelled and total honesty about drugs and what not. nice to see Ringo speaking his mind and turning out to me to be a pretty straightforward bloke. interesting to see how they interact with each other... george is so northern! anyway, if you were a fan, and I was a big fan and i remain so today... you will really enjoy this set. i find it the most interesting and well produced production i have ever seen on dvd. great to see such clarity and crisp shots... better than when we saw them on the scratchy old RTV and BBC. Wow the trip in Amsterdam was something else... blokes diving into the canals and what not. They hated Japan and the Phillipines... great how they stood up the Marcos's..good old yer chaps!
Beatles forever!
Dave Sends Hugs
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Friday, June 20, 2003 at 14:26:47 (UTC)
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Heather,
Those photos remind me of the time, during a varsity break, when Blake Oelerman and I drove two John Deer combines from Lusaka to Broken Hill. By the time we got to the Ploughman's Arms - we were ready for a few ales; and by the time we hit BH (some 10+ hours on the road), we were as red as beetroots from the sun. It was as hot as hell - and if there was any on-coming traffic, we had to lift the tines above the concrete milestones, causing the belts to bind, and the damn things would start harvesting. I remember calculating the cost of those two combines would have purchased 6 brand new Jaguar XJ6's.
By the way, are you sure the Friesian in your photo isn't progeny of the one in Bob's photo?
Dawid.... Wot's all this 'darling' nonsense? Our Gemsbok are on my 'mpongozi' (in-laws) lands, in the North Western Cape - so you can look forward to a long drive. Hopefully, I'll get there next month.
Regards
Charles Cartmill [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Pinelands, Cape Town, South Africa
Friday, June 20, 2003 at 11:54:11 (UTC)
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FARMER-TYPE NORTHERNERS
One of our combines is doing some contracting on a farm on the opposite side of town so I went out and took some photos last week. You'll see that our equipment has progressed since Bob was here, but the cattle still look the same and we still need people to pick up the potatoes.
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Friday, June 20, 2003 at 10:38:16 (UTC)
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Charlie
I was waiting for the Voice of Biltong Reason to speak! How are you darling! And that lovely AFRIKANER of a wife of yours? And your gorgeous intelligent children. And that dog. And that pool?
I will return to my beloved Kaapstad one of these days... but I have so much shite to deal with right now... family illnesses in the States (groan), and a few things here in the Oude Vaderland...
Charlie, surely you jest about the KKNK? I've come to SA just for that in the last two years... the Klein Karoos Kunstfees at Oudtshoorn... that's where I had Springbokke Bobotie. And also where I got to see Stef Bos sing for the first time. Have you heard him? He does a lot of stuff about SA and particularily about the Overberg, which happens to be my favourite part of the beloved Republic! Waenhuiskrans or Bredadorp... that's where I would ideally love to spend my last days. Coming on up real soon now!
Thanks for all the information... I knew all those dribs and drabs from the rank and file was just, well, er dribs and drabs, how we say... those of us in the know,... with our private Gemsbok farms and such... la di dah!
You promised me to take me up there next time I am in the Moederstad... so prepare.
I am off to the People's Republic of San Francisco on the 9 July. Be back in Oud Mokum on 9 August. I must see my father. It is time.
tot straks...
groetjes...
Dave Cooper
Founder of the Great North Web site... a site made out of pure love for Northern Rhodesians everywhere!
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Friday, June 20, 2003 at 03:31:03 (UTC)
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Philip,
By the way, your wife has done an excellent job of teaching you to post messages. Now go and spend some time with her.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 23:58:58 (UTC)
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Jill,
I have a belated contribution in the naming of your dog. How about Gronk? I should ask my perents one of these days where they got the name for the Alsatian crossed with a Collie (I think) that was our pet for much of my childhood in SR.
Mary,
Save one for me! E-mail on the way.
All,
I read Mary's Time and a Legend, which is Australian historical fiction / semi-fiction. It was excellent. If Land of the Long Grass is even half as good, I highly recommend it, especially with its NR connection.
Arthur,
I'm not sure, but I think I was just slighted. I was only giving Philip the opportunity to look good. The lightie at the BH baths is definitely not me, but he does look suspiciously familiar.
Bob,
Nice pics of IDS... oh, and your family too. :) Thanks.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 23:54:49 (UTC)
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Northerners !
Some pics from Bob Eglington
Interesting to see who's in those two pics Bob !
....... and now especially for the farmers bored of the townies, mining junk and people in general.
Thanks Bob! that should keep them quiet for another 12 months at least - I hope. Next time send some shots of them cows drying on the verandah, or on a braai.
Yawn
Arthur
ps - the lightie at BH swimming pool - that isn't CJ is it? Looks suspect to me. It isn't Craig anyway - he was born after black & white photos.
Hullo Arthur
Here is a scan of part of my latest find - a "map" of the Frederick Knapp School from the 1954 (25th Anniversary) issue of the FKS Magazine ! Please turn the image through 90 ° and post it on the GNR if you think it good enough. I will try to scan in the whole magazine but the original is "Roneoed" and 49 years later it is in a delicate state.
Cheers
David Gray.
Philip Pain
No I am not a priest
Good job you confessed though because Craig had already dobbed you in and spilled the beans a little earlier. One thing to learn is that Craig is a Southerner.
The photo of FredericK Knapp was posted on the 5th January 2003 - keep looking and you'll find loads of Nkana-Kitwe stuff in the archives, Nkana Hospital, Rhokana Cinema and some really stunning pics of the old town centre. Also look round the rest of the site you will find load of interesting pages.
I had a quick scan through my horde and came up with these in about half an hours looking
Your school bus
Looks like the editor also went through FKS - I presume this is about your Dad and they spelled your surname name wrong.
Some other finds - and don't relax I will find your photo sooner or later.
And just to prove that FKS was not as butch as you made out earlier
So which school had the ballet lessons then?
Arthur
Arthur Steevens [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Stockport, United Kingdom
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 22:24:16 (UTC)
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Northeners will be interested to know that Zambian born and Zambian educated Professor Alimuddin ("Ali") Zumla has been nominated for the prestigious 2003 UK Windrush awards (Professional Achievement)----see www.anserhouse.co.uk/events/events. The award ceremony will be held in London on Saturday 21st June 2003. Prof Zumla was educated at Lotus Primary School ,Kamwala Secondary School, Lusaka and the University of Zambia. He later went on to do his Post-Grad. Medical studies at London University . He is one of the leading Consultants in the UK on infectious diseases. Currently he is Director of Infectious Diseases at University College Hospital London. He has numerous publications under his name . He has kept in very close contact with Zambia and, apart from being a visiting Professor at UNZA, he has also set up a major Research Centre (on Infectious Diseases) in Lusaka, of which he is Director. His dedication to his country of birth has never wavered and his world standing has enabled him to raise much needed funding for medical research in Zambia.His contribution in the field of Infectious Diseases (and his profile) can be viewed on the web (just log in" Ali Zumla" in the search browser). He has also recently been elected Vice President of the World-renowned UK Royal Society. Ali tells me that he has come into contact with many ex-Kamwala students who have also excelled in other fields. He has also asked me to thank all the Kamwala teaching staff of the sixties and seventies for the high quality of teaching!
( Mrs .Armstrong, Mr. Wade, Mr Gounden, amongst others).
Ayub Ismail Zumla [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Manchester, United Kingdom
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 21:33:00 (UTC)
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Hi Heather,
thanks for the comment on the soda but the recipe which I posted was for the unfortunate ex GRN roaders who only have access to Bison, Reindeer, and Kangaroo. Oh! and cows with a mad disease
Yours
Philip
Philip Pain [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Eshowe Kwazulu Natal, South Africa
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 20:46:35 (UTC)
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Jill
Need to look at what Cape to Cairo would involve but Chris and I could be in. Emailing you.
Tina Magee (née Wallace) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Texas, United States
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 20:46:04 (UTC)
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Heather,
Don't worry about finding out about that institute I asked you about, apparently it doesn't exist, but I got another lead from a Dr Muya. I thought Kwacha meant Dawn - and Ngwee meant Leopard? On account of the red sky thing - I did think about Kwacha - but.....Our Boat's name was Mucha Kwacha (on account of her maiden launch being on Lake Malawi (having towed her all the way from Josi)- and the local people asked how much she cost!)
Doug, A Basenji is a very small dog - and I don't think Tembo will do! However nice the name sounds. I thought about Changa, which is, I think the chiBemba name for a nagapie, but I had a duiker named that...
Charlie - I like the word 'nkuli' - so now it's back to the drawing board - but it's been so great to get everyone's input, I really appreciate it!
Barry - stop bragging about your travels! You make us all green with envy as you must have the best job in the world, lucky beast!
Bye for now - off to Hoedspruit in the morning - oh and best of luck to the equestrian team that's going to Lubumbashi! Nice to know that the Zambians are still competing - when are you guys going to raid South Africa and show us a thing or two?
Have a wonderful weekend everyone!
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 19:50:26 (UTC)
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Hello!
I'm not a regular contributor here, but some of you may be aware of me from my novel, "Land of the Long Grass", one of the few ever written about the pioneer days of Northern Rhodesia. It is loosely based on the real and imagined adventures of Harrison "Changa-Changa" Clark, and was published in South Africa in 2000 by Covos Day, to good reviews.
Unfortunately, Covos Day went bust last year leaving massive debts -- including royalties due to their poor authors! -- and it is highly doubtful any of us will get a bean. One of their writers, Cathy Buckle, who you may know via her weekly email report from Zim and who wrote "African Tears" and its sequel, has been lucky enough to pick up a new publisher because of her topical subject I guess, but "African Colonial fiction" - for want of a better term - is not exactly trendy with publishers, so it's most unlikely that my book will go to another edition and copies are already scarce.
However, through the sterling efforts of a nomadic friend who haunts bookshops both in South Africa and Australia, I have managed to buy back a small supply of mint copies of "Land" which I will be happy to re-sell (signed too!) to anyone interested. The price will be A$15.00 (A$ currently trading at around 67 cents US and 39 pence UK) with postage and packing extra dependent on where you live and whether by air or by surface.
For those who haven't read "Land" as yet, I can guarantee you a rattling good yarn about a time and place that will have special significance to many connected with GNR.
Best wishes to all
Mary Maxwell (née Atkins) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Canberra, ACT, Australia
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 19:45:42 (UTC)
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Arthur,
I must confess I'm not realy a Rocket Scientist but a labourer who digs trenches for the electricy supply commission here in Eshowe. (The only work I can get for R125 a week plus rations) Every now and then I do manage to hit a live wire and get my head into the clouds. ( One of the perks.)
Arthur are you a priest?
I have another confession to make.
My first posting on the message board, well I did not know my behind from my elbow and e-mailed my story to Craig Hartnett who was so kind to post it for me. Please don't ask me about HTML, as I explained to Craig, this Internet thing is totally new to me and only got involved because my two sons have immigrated to New Zealand and I found it easy to keep in contact with them. The only problem I, no my wife has is that I found the GNR and spend more time here than with her.
I haven't seen the pictures of Federick, but will try and find them in the old mail. According to our family, my late sister Lena, who was taught by Mr. Knapp was his blue eyed pupil and could not do anything wrong.
If only I had made an impression on my teachers instead of "P" ing them off! (They had no imagination, just school work! no time to plan your afternoon with your pellet gun in the CAVING IN GROUNDS )
As for your comment on biltong and wine I must inform you I get " gout" from wine and only drink CASTLE LAGER. and in the words of the Leprechauns (a local group from Durban) a dozen a day.
All the best
regards
Philip Pain [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Eshowe Kwazulu Natal, South Africa
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 19:10:41 (UTC)
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Jill
We used to enjoy Simba (Lion) and Tembo (Elephant) beer in Mokambo, Katanga. If you have one dog called Simba hows about called the new addition Tembo?
My brother Keith had a dog called Tembo, so there is a precedent as the lawyers say.
Cheers - Doug
Doug Grewar [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vryheid, Natal, South Africa
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 18:28:22 (UTC)
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Hartley,
Thanks! That's hilarious. :)
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 17:00:31 (UTC)
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Having been looking at the GNR site for sometime I see that little or no contribution has come from the Kitweites, although there are quite a few of us stiil here!!
Just to let you know that us okes living in the 'Republic of the Copperbelt' are still alive and kicking(and drinking plenty of the most beautiful amber liquid "MOSI") Yes, we are still all alcholics and loving it. These days it is almost like going on the Great Trek to hit the Metropolis of Lusaka (which Diggers RFC in the 70's and 80's took great pleasure in putting LRFC in there place!!!) The advent of going shopping in the big Multinational store in Lusaka is a daunting task for any male living on the Copperbelt. You have to take wads of Kwacha's or if you are lucky Credit Cards to give to your better halves (So they keep calling themselves) to do all the necessary shopping.
Luckily we have a lovely pub called 'O'Hagens' which caters for the needs of most of us in terms of sustinance both liquid and otherwise.
Just to let you all know a team if equestrinarians (8 or 9 including young riders) have just departed today from Kitwe to compete in a 3 Day Show in Lubumbashi in the Congo. So as you can see we are still alive and kicking.
Cheers
Brian Rowlands [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Riverside, Kitwe, Zambia
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 16:18:02 (UTC)
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Jill
Sorry, am very busy right now, but will give some thought to your dog's name. I usually name my dogs after politicians - a boxer called Slobodan, a grey dog who was named Zulu after one of our politicians, Grey Zulu, one called Thabo and so on. I'm thinking of naming my next dog Shateen which means bush. Our staff on the farm, when out in the fields and needing to go to the toilet say 'mena humba lapa shateen'.
What about 'ngwee' which means dawn - it is in keeping with 'African Sky'?
Cape to Cairo - I'd love to join you but unfortunately I can only ever be away for a maximum of three weeks at any one time. But if we can plan it right, and my finances allow, I'll join you on some legs of the journey and fly back here in between.
Philip Pain
You story reminds me of when I was about 3 years old (or at least this is what my father tells me - I remember none of it).
My mother was in South Africa visiting her parents and my brother and I had stayed at home with my father. One day he went to a field day at Scholtz Nel's farm near Lilayi (now the Police Training School and I assume also in those days) Sometime around midnight my dad came out to check on us and couldn't find me. After some unsuccessful searching, they called out the police who responded very quickly and joined the search. After a considerable time (my dad says about an hour but I don't believe him) I wondered out of the bush and told them I had been to the toilet. Relieved sighs all round.
Barry
Just imagine!!!! ..... and while I'm stuck here having to eat Zambezi Bream. Though it's better than Kapenta I guess.
I have a solitary crab in a fish tank which I caught in the river about two years ago when it was smaller than a five ngwee piece. It is now about 3 times the size of a 5 shilling piece. Perhaps I should turn him into soup on this cold, icy (about 9 degrees C) winter evening.
Biltong and Bush Nyama
I concur with Craig - there is only one way to eat beef biltong - wet and preferably with lots of fat.
Of course I don't need to remind anyone that the best beef biltong is made in Zambia purely because we have the best beef in the world (Philip - we don't need to use soda to tenderise the meat). But it must also be remembered that biltong dried in one of those biltong driers is not biltong at all. Biltong must be dried on the veranda where it gets lots of fresh air circulating round it and after the second day, you can start inspecting all the pieces to see which ones are ready for eating.
Game biltong - that must be eaten dry, very dry, and is good on bread. Or you can try mixing grated biltong with cream cheese and spreading it on bread.
We also make biltong from baboon for 'friends' and offer it to them as Sitbok biltong. None ever mention that they have never heard of a Sitbok. One day I'm going to make Zebra biltong and offer it for sale at the Gymkhana Club.
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 15:20:03 (UTC)
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Philip
Being a rocket scientist looks like either your head’s stuck in the clouds or you really are from another planet. I note your Dad was called "Cocky" Like father like son I suppose.
I see I touched a nerve, not unexpected though, so often happens with ex-Knappers in S.A. who succumb to the Tsetchy fly after overdosing on the best biltong and wine. Ask John Tyne, he suffers from it so badly now he can’t get out of bed and make a posting anymore. I’m still waiting for some Kitwe photos he promised a while back too.
We have a vacancy here for a suitable conscript to do some of the mundane advertising work on the Message Board. I see from your first posting that you are quite proficient with HTML, unlike our convict cousins in OZ who can’t even close tags let alone centre and change font colour, so you’re a perfect candidate. Also because you are from Nkana we look after our own first. (I will overlook the fact you are from Nkana West)
Now your mission, have you heard of Broken Hill? (I mean in NR not OZ). You will see in the Maps section of the GNR site we have a map of Nkana-Kitwe itself and a collection of maps of the outlying dorps surrounding the Metropolis of the North and Centre of the Universe, we even have one of Kalulushi (which I’m working on just now to remove the mango stains). Well I’ve been told BH was not in fact a black hole and a map really does exist - not the one with a single track and a picture of a tree stuck on it -- but one with proper bendy roads. So we need a suitably worded and colourful posting to be put on the Message Board making an appeal to the GNR Membership to come up with the Hole Grail. The only downside is that you may have to post the message every month as long as you live.
Did you see the photo of Frederick Knapp himself I posted a month or two back and an aerial shot of the school grounds? I have another e-mail in my post box just now from Dave Gray, attached I believe is a map of FKS school, I will deal with that later when I eventually get home, together with one or two other things, so keep your eye peeled on the Message Board a bit later this evening. Oh and I’ll be looking up my horde for a photo of you in the next week or two.
Arthur
Arthur Steevens [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Stockport, United Kingdom
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 13:26:27 (UTC)
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Jane
"My New Kitwe Home" was written by George Grafton (and possibly Bill Baker) for, I think, the Xmas Pantomime "Baskerville" at Kitwe Little Theatre December 1970 - January 1971. Mind you, this is all hearsay, as I didn't arrive in Kitwe until February 1971.
Heather
Continuing the occasional - and strictly non-germane - saga of seafood in various countries of the world, I enjoyed the most delicious crab at "India Jones" at the Oberoi Hotel, Mumbai (Bombay) last night.
Barry Woodrow [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Reykjavik, Iceland
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 12:12:43 (UTC)
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Hi All
I came across this earlier today. I think that it will amuse Craig if not everyone
http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/51/31270.html
Hartley Heaton [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Binfield, Berkshire, United Kingdom
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 10:17:08 (UTC)
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Gordon,
The US of A the greatest country in the world?Do I detect a hint of bias?
Come on!America has never been the same since John Wayne died.
You don't even play cricket over there.Based on current results neither do England but that's only a temporary blip until Yorkshire become strong again.
All the best
Trevor Norman [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Stone,Staffs, United Kingdom
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 09:50:28 (UTC)
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Jill,
Mwizenge made me go a little "nkuli" (meat hungry) - all that chat about the "ndima nkalanga" (dark forests) and "chakwa" (bush meat)- by the way, I thought 'dingi' meant 'an unsuccessful thing or venture' - didn't anyone buy the meat? - or is there some connection to ancestoral sacrifices?
Steve Keeley,
I'm not sure if the Glendower is still there. I'llcheck for you. Last Sunday I had lunch at "Forries" inNewlands - that should nudge your memories of the '70s. Must it be in the Southern Suburbs?
Regards
Charles Cartmill [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Pinelands, Cape Town, South Africa
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 07:19:21 (UTC)
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Charles,
Boy am I glad you reformed - you got a bit carried away there! I am going to the bush this weekend - just for a change! Don't worry, dog's name is not going to be Bundu - because its not PC in our family due to the translation. Even though I like it a lot.
Gilly - I also like Inja - but Otto doesn't like it, so his name is probably going to be Janja which means clever in Swahili. My two Dobermans have Swahili names, Simba and Kali, so we thought we'd continue the tradition.
Jill
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 06:51:01 (UTC)
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Hey Arthur,
sorry about the spelling but I'm a rocket scientist not an english teacher.
If ever Riverain wipped F.K.S. it must have been in flower arranging or ballet definitely not sport (We were the best or so our teachers told us.)
regards
Philip Pain [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Eshowe Kwazulu Natal, South Africa
Thursday, June 19, 2003 at 04:58:05 (UTC)
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Arthur
Thanks for your good wishes.
Sue & Paudie
Sue Forde [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Midleton, Co. Cork, Ireland
Wednesday, June 18, 2003 at 23:01:57 (UTC)
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Whatcha Jilly
How's about "Inja" as in bsop. Couple it with Ninja (as in warrior mutant ..... but he does not have to know that. Alternatively, just the name"Piglet" would suffice.
Hope you realize this poor kid is going to have one hellava identity crisis when he grows up!!!!!!! The guilt is on your head.
Gill Main [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Aberdeen, Scotland
Wednesday, June 18, 2003 at 23:00:19 (UTC)
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Mwizenge Tembo,
I concur. The ‘warts’ on a warthog are particularly delicious. However, the season is also important when ‘treating warthog and bush pig with extreme prejudice’. I also agree that a young buffalo calf is like veal -- but not the ‘dagga boys’!
A place that I have fond memories of is kapolomoto -- can’t be too far from where you grew up, but in the Luano Valley. Mind you -- when I was in the shateen (hell! That really sounds Irish to me!) -- all food tasted great after a long hard day.
NOW YOU’RE REALLY MAKING ME MISS THE BUSH - and I’m a reformed hunter! I used to believe in Game Preservation (turning it into biltong), and I now believe in Game Conservation (making sure there will be enough biltong for me in my dotage).
Regards
Charles Cartmill [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Pinelands, Cape Town, South Africa
Wednesday, June 18, 2003 at 16:27:06 (UTC)
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Charles,
In the late 1950s, my family and I lived at Chasera Primary School among the Bisa people in the heart of the Luangwa Valley. Did we enjoy wild meat! We ate buffalo, hippo, elephant, kudu, impala, etc. There was no beef anywhere and we did not miss it. One of the most memorable was when a village hunter gave us a whole leg of buffalo. My dad sliced fresh pieces to salt and dry over the fire to improve the large variety of stored dried wild meats we had in the kitchen. My mother would the lard which she would add to beans or cooked rice. My mother took all the huge bones of the buffalo leg with some fresh meat on them and put them in our big clay pot and poured generous amounts of water in it. She covered it and boiled the whole thing all day from about 8:00 am. At 6:00 pm, she cooked nshima and finally uncovered the clay pot. I swear the aromas alone could have killed a starving man a mile way. It was that good. She didn’t have to add any cooking oil or spices to the contents. She just added some salt. When the buffalo meat was served with nshima, hmmm…. Was it delicious!! Everything was so tender, the bone marrow was easily sucked out of the bones, the cartledge was tender and the gravy was nice and just with the right consistency for nshima. Oh, life was so good after many such delicious dinners. Incidentally, wild meat in Lusaka or Zambia is informally known as Dingi. In like: “We ate nshima with dingi last night”. Intimate Zambians know how the term “dingi” came about but I don’t want to go there. I had a relative who worked at the Kafue Game Park as a ranger in the 1970s. I once ate Warthog at his house. I think fresh warthog is the most tender meat ever; you cant even compare it to the tenderest fillet mignon.
Mwizenge Tembo [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Virginia, United States
Wednesday, June 18, 2003 at 15:48:09 (UTC)
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In the early 70's all new expats to Kitwe were introduced to a ditty which went (part of it I don't remember and maybe someone can remember), as follows
In my new Kitwe Home (2x)
If you go to a barbeque, call it a braai,
All the dogs are called VOETZAK, but heaven knows why
In my new Kitwe home.
Sorry Jill, just remembering an associated thought.....
However, how does Mushy strike you, best for a female though.
The origins of this ditty I believe lies in the Kitwe Little Theatre and Adrian Nash springs to Mind. I may stand to be corrected. Played often at parties and venues by (late) Mike Glover, and last heard by me being sung by John Costopolous at same theatre
jane
Jane Todd (née Zwanenburg, formerly Bye, Kelly) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Shatti Al Qurm, Muscat, Oman
Wednesday, June 18, 2003 at 15:44:04 (UTC)
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Dawid,
What’s the acronym ‘KKNK’? Is it the "Klu Klux Nederland Klan"?
W.r.t.biltong tastes: I agree with Doug -- Sable is almost at the top -- Roan is No.1. Then Sable, then Gemsbok. As you can see, I like coarse grain meat -- such as beef -- for biltong. Even the old mpoyo (reedbuck) makes good biltong. Springbok is unique -- it makes both great biltong and venison roasts, as does Impala. Kudu has a finer grain - I like Kudu rump roasts.
For venison meals I like Gemsbok, Hartebeest, Springbok, kudu and Bushbuck. Bush pig and Warthog I don’t rank as venison. I must admit I’ve thoroughly enjoyed venison dishes from Fallow Deer (feral in South Africa -- and priced reasonable for hunting). Crocodile -- I once had an argument with a chef, He tried to tell me it tasted like Crayfish, and I insisted I’d tasted better Vundu! Giraffe kebabs -- delicious; but I wasn’t given the opportunity to try Giraffe marrowbone -- with the size of those legs, I probably wouldn’t have recovered. Wildebeest -- Brindle’s far better than Black, but not good venison or biltong. I shot a couple of Black Wildebeest near Kimberley and made biltong. I didn’t like it, but my brother-in-law "Bundu" (Jill: please don’t name dogs after him -- he’s a sensitive little guy!) thought it was the best biltong he’d ever tasted. I must admit the tongue tasted like beef tongue.
Buffalo: Garth Scrooby once shot two young buff on his farm where they were pushing over his fences. He gave me a mealie sack full and I ended up feeding it to my Ridgeback - "Stranger". I know why you had to beat it with a mallet before eating it.
I have observed that the taste of the meat depends very much on what animal eats. I once shot a half-dozen Blesbok, in the Free State, where the farmer had a very large area with no fences. He allowed the game to feed in his mealie lands. The biltong and venison was superb, which is not always the case with Blesbok. Let’s not carry on with that one -- all old hunters (Johnny G?) will tell you why you always find duikers around rural villages!
Now you’ve got me salivating -- and I have to wait a whole month before I get to make more biltong. The one thing I haven’t mentioned so far -- we also make both wet and dry wors from the animal. A gemsbok (plus some sheep fat and off cuts of mutton) will yield about 60 lbs of boerwors!
Other points: from small buck, you get the same cuts as from a sheep -- about 9; but from large antelope you get about 19. Another factor, if you’re a budget hunter, is the dressing out weight. Kudu, Impala and Springbok have the highest dressing percentage -- about 58%. Eland, despite its size, is the lowest at about 51%. Anyway, I digress....
Regards
Charles Cartmill [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Pinelands, Cape Town, South Africa
Wednesday, June 18, 2003 at 14:41:39 (UTC)
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Ali,
Ha! Ha! Good name! Between the two of us with our bloopers - anybody who was reading this would think that this is a special site for blondes! No, I'm not blonde, Johnny.
Jilly!
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Wednesday, June 18, 2003 at 13:25:20 (UTC)
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Jilly ....
..Ooops a misspelling.....should have been GeNnaR....meaning......full of life.......and it tis Germane......
I did think of Bezi.........short for Zambezi.......Oooops, I think I shall slink away.............giggles
Ali
Ali Key [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Perth, Australia
Wednesday, June 18, 2003 at 11:17:51 (UTC)
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Jilly ....
..Ooops a misspelling.....should have been GeNnaR....meaning......full of life.......and it tis Germane......
I did think of Bezi.........short for Zambezi.......Oooops, I think I shall slink away.............giggles
Ali
Ali Key [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Perth, Australia
Wednesday, June 18, 2003 at 11:17:48 (UTC)
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Sorry Craig, I don't know how to use the html - that last posting was supposed to tongue-in-cheek aka - funny?
Oops.
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Wednesday, June 18, 2003 at 10:13:59 (UTC)
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Northerners,
Thanks for all the ideas for names. What does "Genner" mean Ali? I was sort of hoping that Chisanga or Mwizenge or Heather would come up with some indigenous African names.....
Talking of ostrich syndrome, (yet again) surely you made a mistake - you meant to say the good old RS of A.
Jilly
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Wednesday, June 18, 2003 at 10:11:49 (UTC)
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Jilly
How about " Genner " ...........just a thought
Ali
Ali Key [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Perth, Australia
Wednesday, June 18, 2003 at 02:23:45 (UTC)
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Gordon,
You forgot to use the obligatory <DaveBait> HTML tags to show that you were trying to be funny.
You were trying to be funny, right?
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Wednesday, June 18, 2003 at 01:40:04 (UTC)
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Arthur,
Be careful that bloody Mabunu will somma throw you with a stone all the way from amsterdamn. I have often wondered why he forsakes his anglophile ancestry but whupps up the africaaaans heritage. He also shows complete disdain for the greatest country on earth, the U S of A.
Cheers gbg
Gordon Garlick [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Aberdeen, New Jersey, United States
Wednesday, June 18, 2003 at 00:32:21 (UTC)
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Arthur,
As usual, you are the Master. I concede defeat. But I always thought that BS stood for something else, not "blue soap".
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 22:14:51 (UTC)
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Craig,
I won ! - yours didn't draw a morsel of a comment.
I learned from Charlie, you must use blue soap.
Dawid
Before I posted I looked up the difference re the spelling of Afrikans and Afrikaans, as I first thought it was you that had made a small mistake. They never taught Afrikaans at Riverain as you know, my only encounter with the language was to learn the essential words. Other than that I just threw stones at you lot. Perhaps when we meet again we can take up where we left off in Nkana?
I was looking for a photo of George Maxwell just now in some Rhokana Reviews but I suddenly came across a photo and a name staring back at me, Veronica Saunders, anyone remember her? I called her Verruca Saunders for some reason I can't recall just now. But I certainly had a shiver go down my spine when I saw the name.
Arthur
Arthur Steevens [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Stockport, United Kingdom
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 21:59:31 (UTC)
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Arthur
Learn to spell Afrikaans right godverdomme! If you are a PROPER African. Also, Afrikaans is the name of the language, not the people.
Jislaike!
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper
Founder
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 21:04:51 (UTC)
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BARRY
I'm glad you tried making the biltong and enjoyed it. In my opinion, the most important ingredients in biltong (whether you like it wet or dry) are rock salt, pepper and even more importantly, corriander. Garlic isn't authentic. Vinegar is not that important but ok to wash the salt off, but dilute it with water. It does take a while for the vinegar taste to leave though. It takes about 5 days before it's best and obviously the better the beef the better the biltong - try popeseye steak, available from Makro or Asda. Don't forget it shrinks though - you always end up with less than you hoped you would have! I still think the biltong I make myself tastes more authentic than any I've bought commercially in the UKm - and cheaper too.
Fiona Gayther (née Ferguson) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
United Kingdom
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 20:54:48 (UTC)
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Is the Ron Northcote, who joined recently, from Ndola the son of Bill and Edith Northcote who left Ndola to go to New Zealand, please?
Richard and Magie Kneller would love to hear any news, please.
RDK
www.wmcc.cc
Richard D Kneller [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Danbury Essex, United Kingdom
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 19:55:58 (UTC)
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All these messages about biltong remind me of the get together we had in Wallasey in Cheshire last year.
There was biltong there and I loved it, 40 odd years since I had tasted it. I think it was Fifi (Fiona) who told me I could make it myself at home with beef. Well we got home and indeed. We made some and every one loved it. My sons greeded a lot of it and we kept having to make more. You get an empty large cardboard box,( I used a box from a washing machine, obtained from the skip out side the rear of a local elecrical store.)
You push 5 or 6 garden canes through the box from side to side about 6 inches from the top (150mm).
Buy some prime beef, cut it into strips about 1 inch square, 6 to 9 inches long, soak it in viniger and flavour it to your own liking. Salt pepper garlic etc,. Make some wire hooks and hang the strips of meat onto the canes.
Place a 60 Watt electric lamp in the bottom of the box, switch it on and wait for the beef to dry out, 4 or 5 days.
It may not be the best but i is certainly very pallatable.
Try http://members.tripod.com/~areausa/biltong.htm;
Barrie Braidford [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Newcastle upon Tyne, England
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 19:45:44 (UTC)
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Craig, Doug, Jill, Betty, et al
You really must do your homework, Dawid is only 50% Afrikans, the other half is Yorkshire. Hence the propensity to eat bread with everything, including bulldust, wearing a flat cap and nothing much else. Eeeh ba gum can you imagine !
And Philip,
Your recipe looks good, but it wont be the best, here someones Ma provides the greatest there is. And I wouldn't argue on that one. (I see you also went to Frederick Knapp, thats the reason for the spelling, not Kitwe High), maybe we'll get the story again about how the Knappers were whipped by some fresh kid from Riverain once upon a time. Welcome to the GNR.
Sue (and Paudie),
Congratulations, hope everything goes well with your new direction in life.
Bill,
Belated Happy Birthday. Perhaps being a politician you were smoking bulldust yourself? (try grinding it up and trying it with soggy bread as recommended by the Founder).
George,
I just marked your card. I'm looking for a particularly embarassing shot of you in my horde.
Jill,
For the new Basenji how about Tikky ?
Arthur
Arthur Steevens [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Stockport, United Kingdom
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 19:35:37 (UTC)
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Cape Tonians Help! I won 2 tickets to get me back to Africa! albeit only for a visit. I haven't been back since 1975. I went to UCT and want to spend a few days in and around Cape Town before going to Joburg to stay with sister Sandy probably in Dec. I thought it would be nostalgic to spend a few nights at the Glendower hotel in Rosebank where we used to pot back a few beers in the 70's. Is it still standing? If not can someone recommend a hotel in the area? Also do Canadians need a visa for SA? Are there any Muffites out there who are still in the Cape that knew me?
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Cheers and Beers
Steve
Steve Keeley [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 19:34:20 (UTC)
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Dear Dave Cooper,
Winter here in South Africa at the moment and homemade biltong is in. I thought I'd send you my favourite receipe:
BITONG:
Biltong is normally made during the cool, dry months.
The tender cuts, such as fillet, rump and sirlion, should be used (this meat is easly obtainable here as the local population prefer chuck etc.)
For every 25kg meat, allow:
1,25 kg good quality fine salt
250ml (1 cup) brown sugar
50ml (4 tablespoons) bicarbonate of soda
20ml ( 4 teaspoons) saltpetre (optional)
25ml (2 tablespoons) pepper
100g coarsely ground coriander
Note: The sugar keeps the biltong moist and the soda makes the meat tender.
1. Cut the peices into strips of 5 to 7 cm thick, if possible with some fat on each strip.
2. Mix the salt, sugar, bicarbonate of soda, pepper, saltpetre and coriander together. Rub the mixture into the strips of meat.
3. Layer the meat, larger pieces at the bottom, in a wooden, earthenware, plastic or enamel container - never use iron or metal because the salt may react with it. Sprinkle a little vinegar over each layer.
4. Leave in a cool place for 24 to 48 hours, depending on how thick the meat is and how salty you want it to be.
5. Dip the biltong in a mixture of 500ml vinegar to 5 litres of warm water. This makes it shiny and dark.
6. Dry the pieces and hang them up on s-shaped hooks or pieces of string, about 5cm apart, so that air can circulate freely around them. Leave for 2 to 3 weeks, depending on how tender the meat is.
Note:
* Do not cut the strips of meat more than 2cm thick if the weather is not really cool.
* Biltong should be dried in a cool, dry, airy place, protected from flies and dust.
* In humid areas, biltong should be dried in a drying chamber.
* To store in humid conditions, freeze biltong and only thaw enough for immediate use.
Yours Philip
Philip Pain [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Eshowe Kwazulu Natal, South Africa
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 19:29:49 (UTC)
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Dear Betty,
As I am still living in South Africa, and still have the delight of having buttermilk rusks whenever we go camping I have included the recipe to make your own:
BUTTERMILK RUSKS:
1 Kg Self-raising flour
2 eggs
200ml (4/5 cups) Sugar
190g Butter, melted
500ml Buttermilk
5ml (1 teaspoon) baking powder
10ml (2 teaspoons) salt
1. Sift the flour, baking powder and salt into a bowl.
2. Beat the eggs, sugar and buttermilk together.
3. Cut this mixture into the dry ingredients with a
knife.
4. Knead the dough lightly, gradually adding the
butter while kneading. This will take about 7
minutes.
5. Place balls of dough next to each other in bread
tins. The balls should reach about 2/3 the height
of the tin.
6. Place in oven immediately and bake at 180 C (350F)
for 30 minutes.
7. Turn out onto a cooling rack and break into
individual rusks.
8. Lower the heat of the oven to 100 C (200F) or less
and dry the rusks in the oven. Turn them every
30 minutes.
Regards
Philip Pain
Philip Pain [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Eshowe Kwazulu Natal, South Africa
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 18:59:20 (UTC)
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Dave,
Really, I must concur with Craig - wet biltong is best. And I have seen those horrid-looking packets of biltong sawdust they sell, just never been brave enough to try it!
Bill,
I like it - Bundu! Very definitely first on my list for now.
Now as for all you other mamparas....
Linda,
Are you okay? Haven't heard from you in a while.
Welcome to all the new contributors - keep it coming!
Jilly
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 18:31:57 (UTC)
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Craig
Allow me to add some extra bait to the hook. Wasn't the powdered biltong for those Oupa's who had lost their dentures.
And Dawie, surely an egte Afrikaner wouldn't eat it on bread? Surely he would dip his lutoshi (handfull) of pap (nshima) into the powder!
Cheers - Doug
Doug Grewar [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vryheid, Natal, South Africa
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 18:24:56 (UTC)
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<DaveBait>The only PROPER way to eat biltong is WET.</DaveBait>
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 17:25:04 (UTC)
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Betty,
Only among Afrikaner people have I encountered the PROPER way to eat biltong. As you and I have described!
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper
Founder
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 15:00:52 (UTC)
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Dave Cooper
My late mother also used to make the most delicious kerringmelk beskuit (buttermilk rusks) and despite watching and helping her I never quite got the knack. By the time I have dried them out they are so hard that no amount of "dunking" in the coffee helps. When we went on camping trips we used to take tins of rusks with us. I loved waking up to the smell of coffee brewing over the open fire and then drinking it with ideal milk and dunking the rusks. We can get the ready made rusks from selected outlets in UK that are imported from South Africa but the price you pay is daylight robbery.
We invariably came back from these camping trips with loads of venison biltong that we also hammered to a powder when it was very dry and ate on fresh bread. Strangely I don't like venison in any shape or form now, much prefer beef biltong.
I too want to add my thanks for the creation of this site which has put me in touch with so many long lost friends and also brought back happy memories.
In December I met up with my best friend from school days whom I hadn't seen in 36 years, brought together by the GNR, we spent four days talking non stop. She is coming to UK in October. In August I hope to meet up with another school friend I haven't seen for over 30 years.
Betty Mahady (née Horn) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
United Kingdom
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 14:14:44 (UTC)
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I would like to say a big THANK YOU to craig and all those who maintain GNR. I have spent quite a considerable amount of time over the years searching for long lost friends! Then there was the name Mike O'leary! Mike responded promptly to my email and I had found my best friend from primary days in N'dola! Couple of reponses to messages - I was sorry to hear that Mickey Most is no longer with us. I have a great memory of his concert at the N'dola showgrounds. We knew some one who played in the support band and I was able to get his autogragh. Talking of biltong makes me really envious! I was at Victoria Market in Melbourne today and this fellow was offering something that resembled biltong - but at $65 a kilo - this little duck was not buying! I do have another source, but still not quite the same as 'bokkie biltong'!!
Elsabe Lamb (née Swanepoel) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Mount Waverley, Victoria, Australia
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 10:36:08 (UTC)
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Jill a name for your dog how does MONTPARRA grip you,Johnny.
Johnny [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Scarborough, United Kingdom
Tuesday, June 17, 2003 at 07:14:49 (UTC)
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Jill
re:New Dog Name
How about plain old "BUNDU"?
regards
Bill
Bill Hunt [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Widenham, Natal, South Africa
Monday, June 16, 2003 at 21:02:44 (UTC)
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Jill,
Thanks for the explanation of different flesh for biltong and braaiing. I remember the many differing antelope and buffalo that we would get from our hunts in the Nuanetsi region of southern Rhodesia. Buffalo was probably the favourite.
I remember the way we would eat biltong too... not wet, but very, very dry, and hammered with a wooden mallet until it was like beaten bark. Then with bread. It was fantastic.
That reminds me of the biskijt! The place was Battlefields, on a good southern African atlas you can still find it somewhere near the Bubi and Nuanetsi to the east of the Beit Bridge-Fort Vic road... There, Adriaan's mother, Gerda, would make biskijt and put it in a barrel in the kitchen. It was made with karnemelk or even better gecondenseerdemelk. Dunked in strong coffee in the morning, it is beyond heerlijk! Here in Nederland, they also have biskijt, but it is flat, round, delicate and tasteless. It is also not home-made, manufactured in some unknown factory and bought in a supermarkt, Probably owned by the same vile American company that makes those fake potato chips, what are they called? Oh yeah, Pringles. Yuck! They love them here. I refuse to eat them.
Oh dear...
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Monday, June 16, 2003 at 20:36:37 (UTC)
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Doug et al,
The best biltong I've ever tasted is good old Rhodesian beef - very wet! But I have also eaten white rhino 'tong from a hunting farm (Kapama) in Hoedspruit - bloody awful (dark black and tough) and really awful; ostrich biltong - dry and stringy - yuk. I have never eaten gemsbok, but I reckon the best venison on a braai is indeed our national animal the Springbok - really tender and tasty!
Warthog is also very nice spit-braaied. Buffalo biltong is also quite tasty as long as it is still wet - I don't like over-dried biltong - I also love sushi!
We are definitely getting a Basenji (Congolese/African Bark-less Hunting Dog) - Otto and I went to see our new baby yesterday - 15 days old, cute, already yodelling and red and white. His name - all ten inches of him is "Hulin's African Red Sky" - anybody got an an indigenous African name for us to use as a 'pet' name?
Please help here Chisanga and friends - I'd love a nice African name for my new boy.
Ta Ta,
Jill
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Monday, June 16, 2003 at 20:21:09 (UTC)
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One of the best types of biltong that stuck in my memory was from Sable Antelope. John Glen took me to visit a friend farming near Bulawayo. I can only remember their surname which was Swart.
They told me that they were going to give me biltong but only one stick. I thought "mean buggers" and was a bit worried because some farmers have a naughty trick of making "visitor's biltong" out of donkey or even bobbojane.
Well Mnr. Swart was certainly not mean; his one stick was about 4" wide 1" thick and 4 feet long cut along the back of a Sable. Beautifull biltong and it took me nearly a week to eat it.
I agree Kudu is also very nice but I am quite happy even with beef biltong.
Cheers - Doug
Doug Grewar [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vryheid, Natal, South Africa
Monday, June 16, 2003 at 18:51:47 (UTC)
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I understand that Lord Fraser of Carmyllie, who was the senior Scottish Advocate in charge of the Lockerbie case, was born in Zambia. Maybe, if he was really a Zambian, he would be known as plain old Peter Fraser. I guess a good test would be to shout 'howzit Pete!' and watch for the reaction.
George Maxwell [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Edinburgh, Scotland
Monday, June 16, 2003 at 18:20:20 (UTC)
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Dave,
Kudu is my favourite biltong.
Bill,
Oh, so that's what is smoked in Ottawa. And here we in BC thought it was a particularly potent blend of our number one provincial crop!
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Monday, June 16, 2003 at 17:18:48 (UTC)
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Dear Charles and Doug,
Merci mes amis.
Charles.... my Dad is still alive and kicking in Belfast.. I will pass on greetings, tho he may not recollect.... at 92 its day to day and who cares about yesterday.
We had a BBQ/braai here yesterday with 100 + - a political thing -and I flew flags from Canada, Zimbabwe, Zambia, South Africa, Northern Ireland and the USA, where the family is scattered.( Questions and guesses ranged from the Caribbean on.,.,,.... peasants!)
Sort of represents so many of us on the GNR - scattered in the dispora but firmly fixed, at least in memory, in Africa.
Doug, when I see bees , I still flash back to Dorm 4 and you teaching me how to smoke them.
Bill
William Knott [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Monday, June 16, 2003 at 12:03:18 (UTC)
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Zuid-afrikaners!
Hey Charlie and Doug, give us a run-down on the best bokke for biltong and braaing... I always remember waterbok to be the worst tasting. Isn't that right? At the KKNK a few years back I tried springbok bobotie, but I felt terrible eating the national animal man! Ag sies!
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Monday, June 16, 2003 at 12:01:18 (UTC)
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Bill,
A belated happy birthday. My father mentioned to me that he found some old Service Rifle score cards with your father's signature on them. The two obviously shot in competitions together. When I get a copy, I'll forward to you.
Doug,
I was meant to leave yesterday a.m. for a Gemsbok walk and stalk. Unfortunately, I couldn't make it! Maybe next month - I need biltong!
Regards
Charles Cartmill [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Pinelands, Cape Town, South Africa
Monday, June 16, 2003 at 10:00:23 (UTC)
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Bill
A very happy Birthday to you. I am going to a Gemsbok braai today and will raise a glass to your good health.
Your pal from dorm 4 - Doug
Doug Grewar [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vryheid, Natal, South Africa
Sunday, June 15, 2003 at 10:33:26 (UTC)
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Sorry ~ pressed the button too quick!
I wondered how many more 'love stories' are out there... I can think of at least ONE other we heard about at the Banbury Bash...
Sue Forde [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Midleton, Co. Cork, Ireland
Saturday, June 14, 2003 at 11:14:37 (UTC)
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Jill Aplin
Thanks for laughing and smiling -~ that's exactly the reaction I was going for...
Sue Forde [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Midleton, Co. Cork, Ireland
Saturday, June 14, 2003 at 11:12:35 (UTC)
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Can anybody out there help me. I'm trying to locate Mrs. Lorraine Clark who used to teach at Chiwala Secondary School in the Sixties? Last I heard, she was living on some Island somewhere!
Richard Kateka [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Lusaka, Zambia
Saturday, June 14, 2003 at 11:09:34 (UTC)
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Bill Knott and Peter Dielissen
Happy Birthday
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Saturday, June 14, 2003 at 10:20:17 (UTC)
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Hi again David
While laying in bed this morning hoping for a cup of coffee another incident came to mind concerning explosions and bottles. I must have shoved it into the deep reaches of my memory, just recalling it makes me shudder.
Colin McCluskey and I who were neighbours (they moved into 8-4 th. Ave when we moved into No. 8) got hold of a bottle of benzeene which I scaled out of my mom's pantry (She used it for dry cleaning. )
well we took the cork out of the bottle and made a hole through it into which we fitted a FLASH BOMB the best cracker money could buy. (Could hear the bang three blocks away.) Well after replacing the cork we went to Jimmy Carew's house which was accross the back lane at 5-3rd.Ave. and set the bottle up in his back yard under an AVO tree. We then started to call Jimmy to come and watch, as he was taking his time Colin and I got impatient and decided to light the fuse, fortunatly the flash bomb had about a ten second delay and Jimmy got to the back door a few seconds later. I spent many years involved with the army here in S.A. and and can't recall an explosion with such a fireball, well not from that close! The avo tree which was probibly 40 feet high had flames right up to the top branches. We must have all had a gardian angel looking after us that day. That none of us were hurt (Other than singed hair and shaken nerves.) is still hard to believe.
My two boys never ever got the opportunity to experiment like this as all fireworks they had were handled under my supervision.
My sons and their friends did have the oppertunity of seeing me blow myself up.(Another story)
Listening to Trini Lopez-- IF I HAD A HAMMER
CHEERS
PHILIP
Philip Pain [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Eshowe Kwazulu Natal, South Africa
Saturday, June 14, 2003 at 06:42:50 (UTC)
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Sue Forde,
Good luck with your book - really enjoyed reading the snippets on your site - I know nothing about poetry, but I laughed and smiled.
The best thing for me is you and Paudie's 'Love Story'! It made me realise that we need to go ahead and do what we really want - at the time - what if the GNR didn't exist? I also met an old flame through this site - also a guy in a band, funnily enough. For us the wonderful thing was that subsequently we had both met the right person for us - he - the most amazing woman, and me a fabulous man - and we'd both had two wonderful sons. He told me that having his children was the most amazing thing he'd ever achieved!
He is Kevin Mason, and sadly he passed away in December, but the GNR got us in touch after nearly 30 years, and I really appreciate that we got the chance to reminisce and share our experiences - we first met when I was only 16! I think Kev was the grand old age of 19. Heady days, and we were so lucky to still be friends after all those years, but the special thing is that we were able to meet up again through the GNR. Thanks Dawie et al - more compliments, China!
Anyone want to do Cape to Cairo with me next year? - Just asking?
Jill
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Friday, June 13, 2003 at 22:19:54 (UTC)
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Hi David
Thanks for the reply, there are two "incidents" which come to mind involving Glass bottles, the first of which I learnt from Arnold and his mates, this was done by observing what the older guys did. First you had to buid a fire in the back lane, and when this was nice and hot one suspended a closed Mazoe bottle 1/4 filled with water over the fire. The only problem I had was that when I tried this experiment unsupervised an unfortunate garden boy happened to be passing by when the bottle exploded from the build up of steam, I don't know if he was injured because in those days I could do 500 yards in 10 seconds.
The seond incident to which I was an "innocent" bystander involved my best mate Winkie Walker.
Winkie had a cousin who lived in Muf. Now Winkie and said cousin didn't get along too well and at that time. Winkie and I were into Iodene crystals and Ammonia which when the crystals dried out became highly explosive. As Winkie's cousin wanted some of our brew, we mixed up a medine bottle bottle of the stuff for him to take home. Now unfortunatly we didnt have a cork for the bottle and had to put cotton wool into the neck, unfortunatly for Winkie's cousin the crystals dried out on the way back to Muf. and exploded in his pocket causing quite an injury. ( I must stress that it was not done on purpouse but was an "accident" )
When news got back to Nkana and all the screaming started at Winkie's house I kind of stayed away for a couple of weeks. ( I don't know why I got the blame )
CHEERS PHILIP
Philip Pain [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Eshowe Kwazulu Natal, South Africa
Friday, June 13, 2003 at 18:28:06 (UTC)
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Hi Philip
Sorry to hear that Arnold has passed on. I enjoyed your reminiscences about your early childhood and look forward to further chapters in due course! I have it in the back of my mind that you were involved in some experiments which produced a fearsome explosion. I recall Arnold being quizzed about your activities by our Geography teacher one Scotch Mc Lochlan who warned us all of the dangers of mixing chemicals which might react in unexpected ways and never to enclose such mixtures in glass bottles. Needless to say we all wanted to know what particular mixture had produced the bang but Arnold either did not know or wouldn't tell. Let me know if I am mistaken and if so my apologies. If you are the culprit then "well done!" and I hope you came to no harm. Thankfully my experiments with carbide and 'cheesa sticks' didn't result in any major bangs or damage to my person.
Cheers
David Gray [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Friday, June 13, 2003 at 14:40:19 (UTC)
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LINDA, RE- SOLPADENE,
Try www.plainsense.com then do a search for solpadene it has a lot of links that may help you, indeed it may be of help to anyone who needs medical information about any thing.
Regards Barribee.
Barrie Braidford [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Newcastle upon Tyne, England
Friday, June 13, 2003 at 06:52:30 (UTC)
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Sue's Site
to which Paudie has a link to below. It's great. The patterns of her word tapestries are still playing out in my head, warp, weft and web. Her words are honest, serious, playful, true. They leave you thoughtful with a smile on your face, energised and full of the possibilities of life.
Linda
Look after yourself girl.
Tina Magee (née Wallace) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Texas, United States
Friday, June 13, 2003 at 05:57:12 (UTC)
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Hello all,
Please click on the link to see photgraphs of Ndola
http://www.geocities.com/bumbazonkie/ndola1
Yunus Badat [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
London, United Kingdom
Thursday, June 12, 2003 at 23:30:33 (UTC)
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Can anyone from Muf remember what the emblem
on the rugby shirt used to be and does anyone have knowledge where I could arrange to get one.
By the way I'm still living on a 'high' after the Bury reunion.
My old friends were just as I remembered them and now I'm back in regular contact with them I don't feel left out anymore.
When I walked into reception and looked towards the bar it was like going back in time and walking into the rugby club. What a sight for sore eyes.
Whens the next one ????
Cheers everyone.
Mark McDonald [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Eastl Lothian, Scotland
Thursday, June 12, 2003 at 22:58:43 (UTC)
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Linda Hayes ..... Ref: Solpradeine!!!
Hi Linda hope U R all well. Re the above subject. GlaxoSmithKline make the drug u use and their web site is on www.uk.gsk.com also try www.solpadeine.co.uk. Hope the above R a help to U.
Regards - Gary
Gary Brassington [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Banbury, Oxon., United Kingdom
Thursday, June 12, 2003 at 21:14:53 (UTC)
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Sorry this is not germane, but I would like some help please. Can anyone in the UK or Australia point me to a website that will give me accurate and extensive information on the side effects of Solpadeine. I have been getting it from the UK and using it for years for migraine headaches, but am now paying the price in health problems. I am particularly interested in its affects on the liver. Everything I can find so far seems to address the addictive nature of it, which is not my problem. It is not available in the USA, so there is no info here. If anyone has the manufacturer's printout that comes with the box, I would be grateful if you would be willing to mail it to me?
Please email me privately if you can point me in the right direction for this info. Thanks!
Linda Hayes (née Dore) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Austin, Texas, United States
Thursday, June 12, 2003 at 12:15:23 (UTC)
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A VERY HAPPY 18TH BIRTHDAY TO CHRIS MAGEE............FROM ALI AND GIRLS IN PERTH
Ali Key [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Perth, Australia
Thursday, June 12, 2003 at 10:13:51 (UTC)
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Sue Forde
Well thank you for one of the nicest compliments I have ever received about the GNR... at least it touched me that way... believe you me, I once knew what REAL and TOTAL love was all about... for 21 years I experienced that! So when you described what happened, I knew instantly what you meant.
And a bridge between Australia (the wondrous dream world of a country that it is) and Ireland (where I have never been) is a fair idea indeed!
I never knew all this stuff would happen with people and the world and where they all are just because of a few taps on my PC keyboard in a little room in the Sunnyside of San Francisco those seven or eight years ago! Funny how things turn out, hey?
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper
Founder of the Great North Road website
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Thursday, June 12, 2003 at 09:49:15 (UTC)
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|
GREETINGS TO ALL ON THE GREAT NORTH ROAD FROM PHILIP PAIN Firstly congradulations and thanks to all those involved and for all the effort and time spent on organising this web site.( Excuse the grammar I was educated at KITWE BOY'S HIGH) NOTE :- I HAVE HIGHLITED NAMES AND PLACES TO TRY AND HELP READERS MAKE MENTAL CONNECTINS OF PEOPLE, EVENTS AND PLACES. Well where to start? I suppose at the beginning is a good place. My parents, COCKY (ALFRED) and GERTY PAIN came to Northern Rhodesia in the early 1940's from Kimberly with my sister LENA and brothers ALFRED and ARNOLD, they lived in a mine house in third avenue (I think) towards Club street. Of this early history I have little knoweledge as in my early childhood kids were not allowed to hang arround grown ups (the story of being seen and not heard) Unfortunatly all of my family except my eldest brother ALFRED have passed on.Unfortunatly later in life I didn't pay attention when the family got together and reminesed about their old times. Following is a summery of our family tree so that you out there might be able to make some mental connections. (PARENTS) ALFRED (COCKY) & GERTY PAIN (KIDS) LENA (eldest sister) & JOE WINDELL ALFRED (jnr) & ROSMARY (nee NELL) ARNOLD & MAGGIE (nee GUTHERY) and then there was ME-------- PHILIP & VERA (nee KOWALIK) I was born in Nkana mine hospital on the 19th November 1947 (this I don't believe because I know that I was sent here from the plannet ZAAR which is in the 12th Galexy in the costelation ZURCON) I was then taken home to the house where I spent the first eleven years of my life ----8 - 4th avenue. This mine house is on the corner of KITWE street and 4th Ave. accross the road from the mortuary at the mine hospital (4th Avenue is the short avenue which runs from BOMA St to the North entrance to the Nkana Hospital and runs into a dead end with KITWE St.) My earlist recollection of my childhood is my 4th birthday. I remember standing outside the kitchen door under the BOUGAINVILLEA car port in my kharkie shorts and shirt with closed toe leather sandles when my father came out the house and moaned at me for not having my hat on (GREY FLANNEL BROARD BRIMMED these later became skull caps with as many plastic charms from lucky packets sewn onto it) I was forbidden to go out in sun without a hat on. This was a obvious sign that it was not going to be a good day. My family had decided to have a party for my birthday that evening with friends (I think it was HARRY & EDNA NELL who later became my eldest brother's inlaws ) playing the guitar and piano accordian. The evening was agreat success with lots of dancing by the grown ups with the kids running amock out in the garden when suddenly all the grown ups came out of the house trying to stop a fight between my brother in law JOE WINDELL and our neighbour CLEM RICHTER. (the Richter's lived accross the road in 7 - 4th. Ave. GERRALD RICHTER their son was at that time my best friend.) What the fight was about I still to this day not sure, but I think it had to do with Joe dancing with CAROL who was CLEM's wife. IT is interesting to note that how the fight took place out in the garden with all the men forming a ring just like a schoolboy fight with the ladies on the outside screaming for the men to stop! I think Joe won the fight because when I went to play with Gerald his father was in bed with black eys for a couple of days. My second most vivid recollection of my childhood was my first day at school, I had just turned 5 in November 1952 and in January 1953 when school opened my mom had me all kitted out for my first day at the new PRINCE CHARLES SCHOOL which opened in 1950. As we didn't own a car (My parents never learnt to drive their entire lives) my mom and I started off early with a brisk walk to the school to registar me ( I must remind those who can remember how far 4th Ave. is from 18th Ave.) I think my mom was more excited about me starting school than I was. Well after a long wait in which time I was running around making new friends, my mom called me and told me that I was too young to start school as I had to turn 6 in the first half of the first year of school. I rember my mom telling all her friends how dissapointed I was. Thinking back now I don't believe I was, in fact I have a feeling that I was quite happy to stay at home for another year. January 1954 --- 6 years old and I am now at school. The only memories I have of my time at PRINCE CHARLES SCHOOL was being repremanded for being a hooligan ( I was running around wiyh my hankie tied on my face just like a crook in the flicks...Shows what a bad influence movies had on a young mind...Hate to think what effect modern T.V. has on the youth today ) by the treacher who was on duty at play time. (Sub A and Sub B had play time NOT a break ) Another incident which comes to mind and caused my parents much worry and got my hind tanned. When I started school and I had to catch the bus for PRINCE CHARLES SCHOOL at the FEDRICK KNAPP SCHOOL in the morning.(The house boy had to see that I got to the bus stop on time amd meet me after school ) On this particular day on the bus home after school a friend and I were being unruly on the bus (too much energy....I remember getting a kind of puffed wheat which was white and looked and tasted like polistyrene for breakfast )the lady who looked after the kids on the bus warned us that if we didn't stop our nonsense she would stop the bus and put us off. By the time the bus got to the corner of 11th Ave. and CENTRAL St. (11th. Ave was in those days the main road to Ndola, before the SLAG DUMP covered it ) she must have had enough because we were duly dumped on the side of the road. After overcomming the shock of being put off the bus we decided that this could be the start of a great adventure, if we went East for a few hundred yards we would come to the railway line which ran from Nkana station to Ndola. Now we knew that the station was close to Federick Knapp school ( If my memory serves me correct there was a branch line which passed behind the Cadet shooting range which served Rhokana ) My friend and I decided that the quickest way home was to follow the railway line back to the school. Boy! what an adventure for a six year old. I remember standing next to the railway line when a train came past and being buffeted by the wind from the passing trucks. ( Like Wow! ) As we progressed with our journey we started to get experimental, for as we heard a train approaching we would pile ballast rocks onto the tracks and sit on the embankment and watch how fine they were crushed.( This section of line was also used for shunting ) After a while we arrived at the station marshaling yards and had a great time climbing under and onto the stationary trucks and carrages. Life was so different then, no one chased us away and had the occasional train driver wave to us. My friend and I eventually got back to our houses as it was getting dark, both of us pitch black with coal dust, not thinking that we had done anything wrong. I could not understand the thrashing I got from my Mom. (My dad was cool and never gave hidings. ) What had actually happened was that the houseboy had waited for me at the bus stop and when I didn't arrive, went home and told my Mother I was missing. Now in those days we did not have a telephone and as I have previously stated my parents didn't drive. The house boy, kitchen boy and garden boy were sent out with notes to all friends and family with instructions to search for me, this was still in progress when I got home, thus getting the hiding of my short life ( I later got worse ) ( Geez! I was only only about a half mile from the house and it wasn't my fault that that the people looking for me didn't check the station out. I also tried to convince my parents that the lady on the bus was at fault for making me walk home. ) I have tried to recall who my friend was that was with me but I can't. I think his parents forbade him to play with after that incident.( Hey! it takes two to tango. ) ( My wife has instructed me to do my memoirs in short articals as I have only covered two years of what I can remember and I have another 12 to go, and she is sure that there are other people who would like to have something to say ) CHEERS FOR NOW AN OLD ZAMBOON MATE PHILIP
Philip Pain [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Eshowe Kwazulu Natal, South Africa
Thursday, June 12, 2003 at 03:29:08 (UTC)
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GARY and TINA~ Thank you so much for your kind words and congratulations. Both of you know you can do it too!
All those who emailed privately ~ cheers! And everyone who took the time to have a look at my website ~ thanks ~ I appreciate your interest.
There is no way Paudie and I would have found each other again without the GNR!
DAWIE ~ thanks to you and the other GURUS for building a bridge across the water from Ireland to Australia that we could walk across.
I didn't believe that love would ever be a part of my life again ~ it just goes to show ~ it's never too late and you're never too old, hey!
When he stepped off that plane in Oz and put his arms around me ~ it was like 28 years had never happened ~ I was 23 and head over heels again! The GNR did that!
So congratulations Dawie, Craig, Arthur and Heather too for the things that you do everyday which impact in ways you are unaware of!
Sue Forde [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Midleton, Co. Cork, Ireland
Wednesday, June 11, 2003 at 20:00:31 (UTC)
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RON and VERONICA,
I have been away on holiday to Barcelona for a week and have only just caught up with the message board. Thank you very very much for your kind words, AND YES PLEASE PLANT A TREE IN HIS MEMORY. you never know I might make it to Hong Kong one of these days. Please let me know if there is any cost involved. We also loved your poem about the roses.
I also had 81 emails to wade through, most of them rubbish, two of them with viruses attached Norton detected them before I opened them, luckily.
Barrie Braidford [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Newcastle upon Tyne, England
Wednesday, June 11, 2003 at 16:04:22 (UTC)
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Hi all......
Basenjis are Fabled to have stolen fire from a volcano, and the gods decided to take their voices away from them.....so I have been told.....I just love their wrinkled foreheads, to me they are sooooo sweet...yes Tina don't they just have the most wonderful yodel......very houndlike..........
Ali Key [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Perth, Australia
Wednesday, June 11, 2003 at 10:19:08 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S!
Am I allowed to advertise a car sale on the GNR? I forgot if that is illegal or not... anyway, I am selling my SMART Pulse. I put it up on Marktplaats.nl for sale. But if you are interested, ring or ping me.
We don't need cars in Amsterdam.
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Wednesday, June 11, 2003 at 10:11:16 (UTC)
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Sue
Huge congratulations on this publication of your poetry. You have a real winner's attitude. You just go out there with brains, decision, hard work and talent and make it happen.
Basenjis
They don't bark but they have the weirdest howl or yodel. Very strange if you have ever heard it. I heard one in the middle of a big city unhappy because he had been sent outside and wanted IN now now - and I still found myself looking round for the spirits of the forest that had to be haunting the place ;-)
Animal Stories and Pictures
These are great. Ron you seem to have created a little bit of Shangri-La with lots of stories therefrom. So much to look forward to - the hippo pix, Jilly's story and more. Heather we had an owl in the garden in Kabulonga. A Scops owl is the name that sticks in my mind. I tried to see what looked like my memory of him and found the following link - http://owlpages.com/african_owls.html
My impression is that ours looked most like the Common Scops on that site.
Tina Magee (née Wallace) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Texas, United States
Wednesday, June 11, 2003 at 08:11:29 (UTC)
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Hello, I am searching for the person who said he had a photo of me, att my old school in Nkana, the name is called Fredrick Knapp primary school I would be grateful if you answer my letter, thanks a ton, yours sincerely Monica
Monica Rielly (née Pettersson) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Stockholm, Sweden
Tuesday, June 10, 2003 at 20:29:42 (UTC)
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Bill,
I met lots of Basenjis when I lived in Nairobi in the 50's - just that being in the army I wasn't allowed pets, but many people had a Basenji there, yet so few in Zambia even though they are native to the Democratic Republic of the Congo. So, I am not surprised that the one you knew came from Kenya.
Jill
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Tuesday, June 10, 2003 at 19:58:40 (UTC)
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Bridget,
Thanks, I believe many of them (Bisenjis), especially the in-bred ones from USA and England are snappy. but I am not really looking for a dog (But a dog that acts like ac cat) - I am not allowed to have a cat where I am going and Bisenjis are very cat-like (I adore cats). The pedigreed ones are descended from only 14 dogs taken from the Congo, Liberia and Sudan in the 30's.
Bill,
I used to own Pharaoh Hounds, which, from all accounts must be closely related to Basenjis. I adored my Pharaohs, they were really untrainable, clever and cat-like - but BEEG very BEEG to have kitty behaviour, so I am thinking that a Basenji will fit the bill (pardon the pun!). I mean, my Pharaohs would jump on to the coffee table, rather than go round - just to say 'hello' - and they would catch flies with their paws - and open windows, and climb over diamond mesh fences - and were totally aloof, especially with strangers. They were really special.
Thanks everyone for your interest, I shall keep you posted as to whether I do actually get one - there's a 10 day old male puppy I am going to visit this weekend.....
Dawie,
I read your shrew story with horror! It is so easy to think that they are mice - how were you to know that they are seriously carnivorous? You must have been devastated to find the carnage in the morning - awful!
Stay well all - my nagapie story is coming soon!
Jill
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Tuesday, June 10, 2003 at 19:53:04 (UTC)
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SUE FORD
Well done & congrats on publication of your first book. U have made me even more determined to follow up that Open University Degree subject we discussed on phone recently. Paudie good to talk to U on phone recently - the matter we discussed is in hand and will be on it's way to U in post soon.
Cheers - Gary (aka Brasso)
Gary Brassington [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Banbury, Oxon., United Kingdom
Tuesday, June 10, 2003 at 19:51:31 (UTC)
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Jill Aplin
The Basenji dog is an ancient African species often featured in Egyptian tomb hieroglyphics.
It's most interesting characteristic is that it does not bark.
Neighbours appreciate this!
Colin Macfadyen of Mufulira owned one - brought it down from Kenya.
Best regards
Bill Hunt [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Widenham, Natal, South Africa
Tuesday, June 10, 2003 at 19:27:53 (UTC)
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GNR author publishes first book
Ex-Kitwe girl Sue Forde, who writes under the name Frances Macaulay Forde (in honour of her mum), has just published her first book entitled Hidden Capacity ~ a poet's journey...
With true NR grit and determination, and under financial pressures, Sue started a full-time university degree in Creative Writing at the age of 48 to follow her dream of becoming a professional writer. Many of the poems in the first section of this book are themed on the delights and heartfelt struggle of that journey of challenge and achievement.
Here is a sample of one of the more delightfully playful poems from that section, inspired by memories of a creature from her African (and Australian) experiences. If you read it aloud and slowly as the words snake down the page, it's like watching a close-up video clip. And you can almost hear the hisssssss.
Suzette The Snake
Suzette the snake was swish.
She slithered with style
and spoke with a lisp.
Her sensitive stomach
seeks special cuisine,
especially cleaned
in rivers and streams.
She swims in salt lakes
with sensuous ease,
sleeps under shade trees,
shivers out in the breeze.
Skin silvery bronze
sun-yellow striped along
Speeding through leaves
she startles a feed.
Surely her sparkle
and shimmering shape,
proves beauty is found
in a slithering snake!
The last section of the book is about a romantic journey and has a very special connection to the GNR. Sue and I used to go out together in Kitwe in 1973/74. We split up, she emigrated to Australia, and we didn't hear of each other again until we met on the GNR in early 2002. We are now together again. English Poet Laureate Andrew Motion recently said that poems can be "hotlines to the heart". Sue's poems will certainly reach deeply with the romantics among you. She tells with poetry the story of meeting up with an old flame, and all the emotions of falling in love again. So now you have the inside story! Not all the poems are serious, with a bit of humour and other surprise sprinkled in.
The Preface to the book is by the well respected Australian poet, (Prof) Glen Phillips.
I am very proud of you Sue.
For full details of Hidden Capacity ~ a poet's journey..., sample poems, and how to order, go to Sue's website at
www.francesmacaulayforde.com
A big thanks to Craig Hartnett for kindly posting this message on our behalf (special HTML coding was required to format the poem shown above).
Paudie Coughlan, Midleton, Co. Cork, Ireland
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Tuesday, June 10, 2003 at 18:16:44 (UTC)
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Jill Alpin - re Bisenji dogs.
A very good friend of my mother's had one and it was bloody awful! It wasn't good with us kids and would nip at anything! I don't know if it was just very spoilt or what - but it certainly didn't have a "warm and loving" disposition!!
Gill Main
Hope you are back on line - sorry about the phone call - your timing was crap! Will ring you later in the week!
Muf reunion
Has anyone got any pictures they can post? I didn't take my camera but wasn't worried as loads of people - including Mr N. Kenward - were snapping away, so I knew there would be lots of photos to look at. So far I have seen not a one! Come on guys!
Bridget
Bridget Billany [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Blackburn, Lancashire, England
Tuesday, June 10, 2003 at 17:58:52 (UTC)
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Northerners!
Regarding requests for more of my animal encounters (not including my more recent and more highly exciting animal encounters here in Amsterdam!)... my most interesting story took place in Australia over a number of visits and years. I lived in that FANTASTIC country for a number of years in the 1970's. But since those encounters are not germane to the African experience, I have not posted them here. Also, these Australian encounters have an interesting twist in that they are not entirely concerned with "nature", but are heavily intertwined with high tech and computer-aided design!
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Tuesday, June 10, 2003 at 10:31:00 (UTC)
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Jilly......
The cheeky hippo surely must come from Zambia, where else.........
David.......
Thanks for your poignant story about Ki-ingu.....I love these feelgood stories............that reminds me....Dawie ...like Tina it would be nice if you had some more stories about your adventures with caring for orphaned and hurt animals in NR/Zambia......
Alixandria
Ali Key [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Perth, Australia
Tuesday, June 10, 2003 at 09:18:25 (UTC)
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David,
Love your hippo story. Where we are moving to (hopefully) soon there are three hippos in the dam - all ladies. Two come from Limpopo Province and one, the cheeky one comes from Central Africa, but I can't find out where, I wonder if she's from Zambia?
Heather,
Just goes to show you how psotive rescuing birds and animals can be, you rescued those owls 12 years ago and they are still breeding in your area and around your house, lovely story.
Ron,
Until you started posting I have never associated Hong Kong with wildlife, apart from people eating all sorts of inported stuff. Really interesting for me especially to hear about all these animals as they are my main passion.
Jilly
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Tuesday, June 10, 2003 at 07:59:11 (UTC)
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Ron
The short answer is 'yes', there is a photograph of Ki-ingu. The long answer is that I have been looking for it and will scan it in as soon as possible. I wanted to get the story on the Board yesterday, the 27th anniversary of her death.
Cheers
David Gray [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Tuesday, June 10, 2003 at 07:15:12 (UTC)
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Bets McCallum
Welcome, it is great to see another ex Frederick Knapp pupils joining these pages.
You may not know this, but there is a wonderful photograph of one of your birthday parties on these pages. The photo was scanned by the saintly Arthur (who's sarky now?) from the Rhokana review.
George Maxwell [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Edinburgh, Scotland
Tuesday, June 10, 2003 at 05:52:48 (UTC)
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David Gray,
That was a simply wonderful tale of the orphan Hippo from October 1941. Do you have a photograph to share with us all ?
It is just the sort of story that Lawrence G. Green would have included in his book "The Great North Road" if he had known about it.
Heather,
thanks for the photo of the owl, I rescued a tiny collared Scops owl from a hunter's 'mist net' in the valley below the temple here some years ago just after getting my foot caught in a Gin Trap - it took three men to get me out of the Gin Trap after I had dragged it to a fish farm, and it took me several hours to cut he owl free from the 'mist net'. Both of us survived the ordeal and I now keep the valley clear of Gin Traps and 'Mist Nets' whilst the owls call to us during the night to say that all is well in the valley.
Cheers Ron
Ron Clibborn-Dyer [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Hong Kong SAR, China
Tuesday, June 10, 2003 at 00:38:23 (UTC)
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A Little Hippo Goes a Long Way.
During my last trip to Pretoria two weeks back I managed to contact Dr. Ferdi Schoeman, the keeper of records at the Pretoria Zoological Gardens, to find out more about a baby hippo rescued by my Dad (Bill Gray) and Uncle (Len Vaughan). My Dad and Uncle Len were on a hunting trip along the Kafue when they came upon the carcase of a mother hippo with her live baby beside her. Mother hippo had been savaged by crocodiles. They had no sooner found the baby when it was attacked by a medium sized croc. My Uncle shot the croc and helped Dad rescue the baby. They nursed it back to good health but it carried scars of the attack to its death. How they managed to feed it I do not know but it followed them around like a dog and used to sit on my Dad's boots beside the camp fire. All this happened on the the 7th of October, 1941. Dad returned to N'kana and Uncle Len cared for the baby hippo at Lochinvar Ranch which he owned at the time. The name "Ki-ingu" (Sp?) was given to this fast growing female hippo. Can anyone tell me if there is an area or tributary of the Kafue near Monze called Ki-ingu as I believe that the hunting trip took place around that area and that the baby was named after the place where it was found. Ki-ingy grew apace and something had to be done. She still followed Uncle Len around and was eating the Vaughns out of house and home. Letters were sent to various zoos and Pretoria zoo showed interest. In early 1942 Ki-ingu was sent by rail to Pretoria. Extensive preparations had to be made as the 'baby' had to be fed regularly and gallons of milk and dozens of eggs were waiting for it at various places between Monze and Pretoria - no mean feat in wartime . The records show that Ki-ingu arrived at the zoo on the 14th of February 1942 and that my Uncle received £85/00/00 for his trouble. An African Mirror of that year shows a fair sized hippo in her pool at the zoo. Ki-ingu was too much of a mouthful and so her minder renamed her 'Griekie' !!!!! I was taken to see Ki-ingu in 1946 - this visit to Pretoria was notable for that and the fact that I heard my first jet plane there - I didn't look in the right direction as it streaked over Pretoria!
I heard that Ki-ingu had produced a calf but was surprised to learn that she had given birth to no less than 15 offspring, the first on the 1st of December 1951 and the last on the 7th of December 1972. One of her calves was sent to the Lichtenberg breeding station in 1964 and another was sold to one Mr van den Brink, an animal dealer in the Netherlands. Ki-ingu died on the 9th of June 1976.
David Gray [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Monday, June 09, 2003 at 16:46:29 (UTC)
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Car Hire For Livingstone Lark
Car Hire is also available from Voyagers Rentals (Email: carrental@voyagers.com.zm)
For example a Toyota Corolla 1.3 without aircon would cost:
7-14 days (Self drive) US$33.00 per day US$0.30c per Km
They also ahve a combination rate which allows 150 Km free per day with any additional distance being subject to their standard rate charge.
7-14 days US$63.00 per day (Self drive)
Insurance Options are
CDW limited cover - $10.00 per day
CDW full cover - $17.00 per day
TLW limited cover - $5.00 per day
TLW full cover - $9.00 per day
The above rates are exclusive of 17.5% VAT
An International driving licence would be required and payment can be made by Visa or Master card.
I can recommend them.
This info will be added to the Livingstone Lark page in due course.
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Monday, June 09, 2003 at 12:25:48 (UTC)
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Vivian Kuiper, Robert Trail, Marianne Martin, Louis Fuchs
Happy Birthday
Jill et al
I don't know all the scientific reasons, but I do know that shrews have an awful smell. When we manage to retrieve them from our cats' mouths, still alive, we take them back into the garden as quickly as possible. The only problem is that we never know where the cats caught them. And they never eat them, only bring them in to play.
And here is another picture for you. About 12 years ago, I went over to one of the farms in the neighbourhood and they had been taking owls out of the chimney. When I got there, they had already killed some of them, but I managed to save twelve, which I took home. They were of varying ages, some of them only had fluff, no feathers yet. We fed them guinea pigs for the first few weeks and then opened the cage when they had settled down. Unfortuately, some of them ended up as dog snacks, but others survived to breed and they still hang around our garden. I managed to get a photo of this one a couple of weeks ago, in the tree outside the front door.
Ron
The picture was one which I took, but if you search on google you'll find plenty of info on elephant shrews.
Mwizenge
Yes, nothing beats the bream that come out of the Zambezi around Mongu and Libonda. Zambian beef - nothing beats that either, but there are two types of beef and each must be cooked differently. The beef from cattle raised on commercial farms where they are given supplementary food, must be eaten rare. The beef from the village cattle who have no supplementary feeding, must be eaten well cooked, preferably on a fire. I had a delicious steak at the Lyambai Hotel when I was in Mongu in April.
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Monday, June 09, 2003 at 12:02:32 (UTC)
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Betty...some more
1972...respect your elders
2003...scream and swear at them
1972...respect other people's property
2003...vandalise it
1972...students afraid of teachers
2003...teachers afraid of students
1972...clip round the ear
2003...visit from Social Services
1972...love and romance
2003...sex and more sex
1972...marriage
2003...living together
1972...mum and dad
2003...dad and dad or mum and mum
1972...caring for the old
2003...shove them into nursing homes
1972...air letters
2003...photo messaging
and so on.........
Ayub Ismail Zumla [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Manchester, United Kingdom
Monday, June 09, 2003 at 10:41:55 (UTC)
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Light relief: What a difference 30 years makes...
1972: Long hair
2002: Longing for hair
1972: The perfect high
2002: The perfect high yield mutual fund
1972: KEG
2002: EKG
1972: Acid rock
2002: Acid reflux
1972: Growing pot
2002: Growing pot belly
1972: Trying to look like Marlon Brando or Liz Taylor
2002: Trying NOT to look like Marlon Brando or Liz Taylor
1972: Seeds and stems
2002: Roughage
1972: Popping pills, smoking joints
2002: Popping joints
1972: Killer weed
2002: Weed killer
1972: Going to a new, hip joint
2002: Receiving a new hip joint
1972: Rolling Stones
2002: Kidney Stones
1972: Being called into the principal's office
2002: Calling the principal's office
1972: Screw the system
2002: Upgrade the system
1972: Parents begging you to get your hair cut
2002: Children begging you to get their heads shaved
1972: Taking acid
2002: Taking antacid
1972: Passing the drivers' test
2002: Passing the vision test
1972: Whatever
2002: Depends
Just in case you weren't feeling too old today, this will certainly change things. The people who are starting college this year across the Nation were born in 1984.
They are too young to remember the space shuttle blowing up.
Their lifetime has always included AIDS.
Bottle caps have always been screw off and plastic!
The CD was introduced the year they were born.
They have always had an answering machine.
They cannot fathom not having a remote control.
Popcorn has always been cooked in the microwave.
They never took a swim and thought about Jaws.
They can't imagine what hard contact lenses are.
They never heard: "I'd walk a mile for a Camel"
They do not care who shot J. R. and have no idea who J. R. is.
They don't have a clue how to use a typewriter.
May your bones be with you!
Betty Mahady (née Horn) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
United Kingdom
Monday, June 09, 2003 at 10:09:32 (UTC)
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Bill
Happy to have given you a good chuckle and some fond memories ;-)
Dawie
The Shrew Massacre story was a glimpse into a very interesting side of you - working to heal hurt fauna in Zambia. You must have come to know some fascinating non-humans. Do you have any more stories of them to tell?
Tina Magee (née Wallace) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Texas, United States
Monday, June 09, 2003 at 08:35:42 (UTC)
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Obituaries
As most of you are probably aware, there is a section on the GNR for obituaries. There have been a couple of additions there recently, which is why I am bringing it to your attention again now.
At the bottom of the page are instructions for adding new obituaries. The process is currently the same as for joining the GNR, but when I have some time I will refine it so that the procedure is specific to obituaries.
Additionally, we have lost a couple of GNR members since the obituaries were added sometime last year. I'd just like to remind everyone that I need to hear personally (via e-mail at least) from someone before I move a member from the Names Directory into the obituaries. I won't take that action on my own accord after reading a message here on the message board about someone's death. Thanks.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Monday, June 09, 2003 at 00:32:44 (UTC)
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NORTHERNERS,
Have any of you owned or known personally a Basenji dog? They are originally from the Congo and I am thinking of getting one, but would like to hear first hand about their temperament - perhaps the Belgian Congo people would know?
There were actually lots of these dogs in Kenya in the 50's, but I have seen one or two since then. I met one today, but he was stressed at a huge dog and cat expo in Joburg, and it was difficult to tell anything about his temperament.
Thanks,
Jill
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Sunday, June 08, 2003 at 21:39:43 (UTC)
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Bets,
Mike Abraham is a member of the GNR, so you can contact him through his Directory entry. However, Keith Parkinson is not a member.
My apologies that you can't browse or search the Names Directory at the moment, but I'm working on getting that working again.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Sunday, June 08, 2003 at 21:20:36 (UTC)
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looking for Mike Abraham - ex Chingola and Keith Parkinson - ex Kitwe
Bets McCallum (formerly Lentin) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Cape Town, South Africa
Sunday, June 08, 2003 at 18:01:13 (UTC)
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Tina Magee (Poetess Laureate!)
Thanks for your superb written rendition of a live mental picture of the Tassler's skills!!
Ah! Those were the days.
Best regards
Bill Hunt [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Widenham, Natal, South Africa
Sunday, June 08, 2003 at 17:05:07 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S !
Because my intense interest in the World Wide Web since I first started "messing" with it in 1995, I do a lot of surfing about for odd stuff. Occasionally I like to check on our links here on the Great North Road.
As most of you know, I have a special spot in my heart for the old Belgian Congo... and today there are even mores sites coming to the surface than even just a few weeks ago.
For example, I notice a lot more sites in Congo on ex-pat affairs than for Zambia! We may have been first, but they control the field now.
If you have an interest in maps of the colonial period, check this map out of : lower Katanga. It's pretty groovy in my opinion.
Straks...
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Sunday, June 08, 2003 at 14:47:49 (UTC)
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Arthur,
Thanks for the great pictures especially Chitalu who is my hero; all the 6ft 5in of him. Yesterday I listened to the record with my son of the soccer commentary by Liwewe of prehaps the greatest game ever in Zambia in Ndola in which Chitalu scored two crucial goals in extra time to beat Uganda 4-2. At that time in 1977 Chitalu was considered in his twilight years of his career. He came in as a substitute. What if Chitalu had played to day or if the entire Zambian soccer team from the 1970s had played to day?! To-morrow morning June 8, my son and I will travel to Richmond to watch the US national team play New Zealand.
Heather,
Your description of the Livingstone Lark program didn’t make an impression on me until you mentioned, “grilling on real malasha, (charcoal) and eating nshima”. If you add Mosi to that, life can really be heaven on earth. Although I don’t drink much anymore, Mosi may be the best beer on earth. I don’t eat beef here. The Zambian beef is actually sweet beef because the cows jog many miles everyday and they eat fresh grass. I eat it all the time when I get back home. Talking about grilling on real malasha, I once ate a grilled fresh Zambezi bream with nshima at Lyembai Hotel in Mongu in November 1976. I have never forgotten that experience. Oh, my!!! Was it delicious?! These are one of those moments I wish I was a millionaire. Then I would attend the Livingstone reunion just for the food. Good luck organizing it. I hope a lot of Northerners can attend.
Mwizenge Tembo [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Virginia, United States
Saturday, June 07, 2003 at 17:10:39 (UTC)
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What is that old saying about boys never growing up? Either there was an abundance of one-eyed, mind-boggling, tassel tossers on the Copperbelt over a span of 20 years or this talented "lady" must have really made the rounds. Sounds like some of you may well have been traumatized for life by her eye-popping act. Can anyone remember the colour of her eyes? He! He!
I would much rather see more piccies of Ron and his python than read stories of this stripper... oops (grin)
Linda Hayes (née Dore) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Austin, Texas, United States
Saturday, June 07, 2003 at 05:02:14 (UTC)
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Bob,
Great story and pictures.
Ron,
What can I say?
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Saturday, June 07, 2003 at 04:17:07 (UTC)
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To those who have been patiently waiting to join the GNR
The form to join the GNR is finally working again. Sorry for the delay.
I will hopefully (touch wood) have the form for editing existing entries working again before I go to bed tonight or on Sunday.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Saturday, June 07, 2003 at 03:22:32 (UTC)
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All the chat about tassle tossers reminds me of a club on Broadway in Ndola in the '60s. It was nearly opposite the CAA office as I remember it, and the name Rhino comes to mind but that could be miles off.
I was told about a star attraction who could twirl them as fast as a DC-3 propellor, so after work an outing was organized and a caravan headed on down.
We didn't know what to expect and the show began. As I had been told, she was an expert, but a chuckle started in our group and developed into a roar.
It took me months to live down that night as although the body could have found a home in "Playboy", the unfortunate young lady only had one eye with a false one that always stared ahead of course.
The customers, in their cruel drunkenness, myself among them, ashamedly, started up the chant "We want Xyclops."
Not one of my shiniest moments in time, but who knows what levels a crowd of drunken 20-years-olds will sink to.
I tried Spellcheck for "Sigh-clops", but no luck.
Robert Summers [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Dayton, Ohio, United States
Saturday, June 07, 2003 at 03:00:31 (UTC)
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Northerners !
Some great photos and contributions from the members !
Arthur
Dear Arthur,
The GNR is a great site. I just wish more Northerners would know about it. I have attached a few photographs
Mwizenge Tembo
My family have got used to me calling for their assistance when I bring a snake home. We usually weigh it, measure it and count the scales to make a positive identification of the species, as no two species have the same scale count. So Veronica has no problem draping a python round her neck.
In fact we have taken pythons to her kindergarten to teach the very young children about snakes - they usually have no hang-ups, unlike their parents.
Cheers Ron Clibborn-Dyer
Arthur,
Below is the story promised to Heather and pics of the event.
Kind regards
Bob Eglington
One Saturday afternoon there was nothing going on, Tim and I were in the dormitory listening to a portable radio when one of the six formers from dorm four entered with a pile of London Illustrated Newspapers in his arms. He asked the two of us to give him a hand to which we readily agreed although we did not have a clue as to what was the project. Producing a pot of paper glue we were told to stick sheets of newspaper end to end along the dormitory floor. The beauty of the London Illustrated is that this paper is very different to normal newspaper. It is much thinner, far stronger and has a clear even margin down each side. Applying glue to one margin you then stuck the second sheet's margin to the first until there was five sheets all stuck in a row. This was repeated for fifteen more rows. When the glue on the rows of sheets was dry then very carefully the three of us together folded each row in half, length wise, making sure there was a neatly sharp hand pressed crease. Along the top edge of a folded length, glue was applied and the next rows under edge was matched to the glued edge and firmly pressed home. This was repeated until the edges of the fifteen rows were glued one on top of the other. One end of the row, a quarter of a circle was cut whilst at the other end from a position of two newspaper lengths a taper was cut to half the original folded width. Where the ends had been cut these were carefully glued edge to edge. Waiting for the glue to dry we then folded out the top row and turned the pile over. The folded out row was carefully glued to the remaining edge so that each edge of each row was glued to its corresponding edge. Other lads were now back in the dorm but not allowed to help in any way, could observe but no help thank you. Finding some paints the three of us printed our names and added a couple of patterns on the uppermost folded row, we also included the name of the hostel. The whole lot was very carefully folded over into a six-foot length and placed underneath my bed for safe keeping.
The next morning Tim and I were asked to find a long length of sturdy wire. Slipping out of the school grounds we made our way into the bush where we knew there was a fence around a small holding. A stout wire was fixed to the top of wooden posts sunk into the ground. This wire supported chicken wire that ran around on the outside circle created by the posts positioning. We were able to remove a section of the top wire and coiling it up in a big coil carried it over my shoulder as Tim and I trotted back to the dormitory. The six former measured a length of wire off and bound it into a large circle. A second straight piece of wire with a small loop in the middle was securely attached across the circle dissecting it in two halves equally. The folded rows of newspaper were unfurled along the floor of the dormitory. The tapered end of the rows was fed over and around the wire hoop and glued back upon itself. Now every one in the dorm could help, very carefully the whole assembly was carried outside between dorm two and dorm three. This was the location where the boiler house was which was under ground in its own basement. A couple of lads disappeared down the concrete steps into the boiler house to emerge with a metal fire bucket half filled with red hot coals. The wire circle part of the newspapers was very carefully placed over the fire bucket and the hot air given off started to fill the balloon out. A couple more buckets were fetched over a period of time and the hot air built up so that around the bottom of the circle a number of hands were required to hold the hot air balloon steady. A bundle of rags wired together was soaked in paraffin and attached to the loop in the centre of the bottom circle of the hot air balloon. The fire bucket was removed and the bundle of rags lit with a match. On the count of three we released the now straining hot air balloon and it soared up between the two dormitories higher and higher into the sky.
As soon as the hot air balloon cleared the rooftops a gentle cross wind blew the balloon over the school and up, up and over the girls section on towards Lusaka township. To judge the height of an object is very difficult but I can safely say that it was over a thousand feet high when the whole cylindrical newspaper hot air balloon slowly turned over onto its side. By this time the twenty feet long sausage shape looked no bigger than your thumb and with the late afternoon sun shining upon it from a low angle it appeared to be metallic and the sun rays reflected gave it a silver colour as the breeze ruffled on its steady progress towards Lusaka. The flame had died down but the bundle of rags attached at the end glowed bright red and for all the world appeared as though a rocket ship was slowly passing overhead with its burner on. Simply brilliant, and the three of us were all accepting the accolade from the other boarders who were by this time all standing watching the experiment drifting further and further away. Suddenly in the sky there was a small single engine aircraft approaching in a very cautious manner. The aircraft did not fly directly but approached in a very wide circle which was slowly decreased in size each time it made a circuit of the rocket. By this time the glow had been extinguished and the two flying objects were out of sight as twilight fell. The whole episode was just fantastic.
Next morning at school assembly the headmaster called out our names to visit him in his office immediately after assembly. The three of us presented ourselves wondering what it could have all been about. On our short walk the only thing we came up with was that we had been rumbled for purloining the wire from the fence but how, if we were seen and reported by the owner of the fence, that our names would be known? The headmaster sat behind his desk whilst the three of stood in front. Sitting there the headmaster stated that he simple did not know what to do, to congratulate us on our initiative or to give us a right telling off. It seems that our hot air balloon had come down at the airport inside the fenced off storage area where the large tanks of aviation fuel was stored. The penny clicked, we had printed our names and our house Denny for Ever on the hot air balloon! With that we filed out to our classes and nothing more was said only that the three of us for a while had a very good feeling about the whole issue.
Firstly would like to say what a great site............
I do however rarely come across Kalulushi/Chibuluma contacts or pictoral submissions.
Hopefully I can correct that a little with the enclosed....
Hope this works!!!
Chibrfc was 1979 & Chib2 was 1981
Again hope this works and gets posted..
Arthur...Mwashibukeni mukwai mwashibuku shani..
Check these out....
Map of Kalulushi
The chibuluma news
Darts at Chibuluma rugby club
Visiting Zambian troupe
Single skull mindola
Double skull mindola
A four at mindola
Yes we did catch fish at nkamba bay
The lodge & beach at nkamba
Rondaavel at nkamba bay
Brings back memeories..
Regards
Geoff Rawlinson
Fantastic work everyone - thank you.
I have a number of unseen images in the horde, sporting teams old and not so old - when I get a bit more time I'll post a few up.
And yet another brilliant map !
I have posted the Kalulushi map on the message board "as is" - I will do a bit of work on it over the next week or two before it joins the others in the Map section of the GNR.
Now....
What was that other town ? Um - can anyone verify its existence and put it on the map? Not a cats chance in broken hell.
Interesting snap of Ron with the snake - I thought it was only the tassle twirlers who wrestled with snakes in this way?
Arthur
Arthur Steevens [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Stockport, United Kingdom
Saturday, June 07, 2003 at 00:55:17 (UTC)
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I have a story or two on Night Apes, Civets and the Slender Loris of the Far East, but first a piece on Roses, since the ubject of how to Touch the Heart of a Loved one has been raised.
Get out your hankies NOW
Rose's Roses
Red roses were her favorites, her name was also Rose.
And every year her husband sent them, tied with pretty bows.
The year he died, the roses were delivered to her door.
The card said, "Be my Valentine," like all the years before.
Each year he sent her roses, and the note would always say,
"I love you even more this year, than last year on this day."
"My love for you will always grow, with every passing year."
She knew this was the last time that the roses would appear.
She thought, he ordered roses in advance before this day.
Her loving husband did not know, that he would pass away.
He always liked to do things early, way before the time.
Then, if he got too busy, everything would work out fine.
She trimmed the stems, and placed them in a very special vase.
Then, sat the vase beside the portrait of his smiling face.
She would sit for hours, in her husband's favorite chair.
While staring at his picture, and the roses sitting there.
A year went by, and it was hard to live without her mate.
With loneliness and solitude, that had become her fate.
Then, the very hour, as on Valentines before,
The doorbell rang, and there were roses, sitting by her door.
She brought the roses in, and then just looked at them in shock.
Then, went to get the telephone, to call the florist shop.
The owner answered, and she asked him, if he would explain,
Why would someone do this to her, causing her such pain?
"I know your husband passed away, more than a year ago,"
The owner said, "I knew you'd call, and you would want to know."
"The flowers you received today, were paid for in advance."
"Your husband always planned ahead, he left nothing to chance."
"There is a standing order, that I have on file down here,
And he has paid, well in advance, you'll get them every year.
There also is another thing, that I think you should know,
He wrote a special little card...he did this years ago."
"Then, should ever, I find out that he's no longer here,
That's the card...that should be sent, to you the following year."
She thanked him and hung up the phone, her tears now flowing hard.
Her fingers shaking, as she slowly reached to get the card.
Inside the card, she saw that he had written her a note.
Then, as she stared in total silence, this is what he wrote...
"Hello my love, I know it's been a year since I've been gone,
I hope it hasn't been too hard for you to overcome."
"I know it must be lonely, and the pain is very real.
For if it was the other way, I know how I would feel.
The love we shared made everything so beautiful in life.
I loved you more than words can say, you were the perfect wife."
"You were my friend and lover, you fulfilled my every need.
I know it's only been a year, but please try not to grieve.
I want you to be happy, even when you shed your tears.
That is why the roses will be sent to you for years."
"When you get these roses, think of all the happiness,
That we had together, and how both of us were blessed.
I have always loved you and I know I always will.
But, my love, you must go on, you have some living still."
"Please...try to find happiness, while living out your days.
I know it is not easy, but I hope you find some ways.
The roses will come every year, and they will only stop,
When your door's not answered, when the florist comes to knock."
"He will come five times that day, in case you have gone out.
But after his last visit, he will know without a doubt,
To take the roses to the place, where I've instructed him,
And place the roses where we both will be, together once again."
Ron Clibborn-Dyer [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Hong Kong SAR, China
Saturday, June 07, 2003 at 00:20:11 (UTC)
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Been away for as couple of days so here is a response to the tassle twirler stuff.
Sometime in the 50's... I cant recall when, my Dad and I and a bunch of Mufulira rifle shooters went down to (then) Salisbury for the Rhodesian Rifle Championships.
During the time there, the bunch of adults decided to go to the -only-? strip club in the Federation. Moi was dragged along-- as one of the competitors. We sat at a table near the dance floor. As a 'kid' and with the sense of humour only Muffies have, they put me nearest the floor. The lady came out and did her thing with veils and music etc. She popped over to our table and proceeded to slither all over moi and the end of the table, accompanied by roars of laughter from my Mates. Ha.
I was put off by the varicose veins on the back of her legs and have , really, never gone to a strip joint since.
That was similar to my childhood experience of roasted green peppers during the war. Cant stand the smell to this day
Bill
William Knott [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Friday, June 06, 2003 at 23:10:21 (UTC)
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Peter,
I really like your style and I bet your wife thinks you're wonderful! You really understand the game! Clever us Zambians - wait for tips on how to bribe hubbies! Actually, I believed my Mum when she told me that the way to a man's heart was through his tummy. I know abour other routes now, but the food thing is also really effective and I love cooking - especially spicy exotic dishes. Even my sons won't leave home now!
Talking of poetry...
I am working on a rhyme for all you wonderful correspondents on this site - I'm battling somewhat - but, with a little help from my friends.... - watch this space.
I'd like to hear about some more nagapie stories - I have a great one....but I want to hear yours first!
Love, Jilly
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Friday, June 06, 2003 at 22:02:14 (UTC)
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Peter,
Truely representative of BH!!
Heather (et al - and Johnny of Tassle Tosser fame)...
All the talk about shrews reminds me of something I read in my youth (some thousand years ago). Many tribes in Africa used the plant Acokanthera to blend the poisons they’d place carefully on the shafts (just behind the head) of their hunting arrows. A few tribes would "boost the mix" by add Saphium Madagasscarinsis (sp?) which, when touched, causes an inflamation -- accelerating the Acokanthera poison’s progress. Other tribes would add Dioscorea -- as poisinous as Acokanthera. BUT -- the Giriama (Tanzania?) would throw in the decomposed body of an Elephant Shrew! When you chase an Elephant Shrew it, will always run in a staright line; thus the Giriama believe this will cause any animal killed by arrow poison to run straight instead of tumbling off sideways into the bush!
These African traditions always have a seed of logic to them. I recall an article, written by Norman Carr, where he gave an example. He mentioned that all rural natives believe that you can never be lost in the bush. If you "feel" you’re lost -- just go to sleep and wait for the new dawn. The first bird to "drum" in the new dawn will be the Ground Hornbill -- and that will be from the East! A Westerner may query this logic, until he reasons that prevalent winds blow from the East!
Now I know why most of my Western born friends can’t understand me!
Charles Cartmill [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Pinelands, Cape Town, South Africa
Friday, June 06, 2003 at 18:05:46 (UTC)
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Peter "Casanova" Dielissen
Too true. Sometimes people forget that just being nice can make you stand out from the crowd.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Friday, June 06, 2003 at 16:34:07 (UTC)
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Hi Dawie...
Same in Canada with good tradesmen. Harder to find then hens teeth.
I'll be in Amsterdam June 23/24 - Are you around for a drink?
I forgot to tell you in my bribery note that I bribe my wife regularly with red roses and love poems. Mega payback guys!!!
Please and thank you work quite well in this world as well.
BTW - for those guys who are poetry inept like me... Every February 14 the newspapers carry Valentine day sections which contain 100's of poems. Pull it out and keep it at work with a bunch of blank cards. Twice a month go to the florist and buy two roses with baby breath, snarf a poem from the Valentine section and copy it to the card. Voila instant romance!
Peter Dielissen [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Fredericton, New Brunswick, Canada
Friday, June 06, 2003 at 16:12:17 (UTC)
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Peter,
I think I might have shown you images of my loft in San Francisco, in which I sunk over one hundred thousand dollars worth of improvements. Bribes were sometimes the ONLY way I could get anything completed in a timely manner.
Oh, by the way, did I mention the name of the country this was located in?
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dawie die Verskriklike (en trots van dat!)
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Friday, June 06, 2003 at 13:38:08 (UTC)
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Northeners
Re: the discussion of bribery...
Bribary is a BIG part of my life and opens all kinds of doors here in North America. For example:
*** I am a cheapskate when it comes to buying airline tickets but have a taste for "First Class". So I have bought on e-bay tons of old Air Canada stuff from the thirties and early forties such as timetables, tickets, photos, advertisements, route cards, in flight information packages, cigarette tins etc etc for around $5 each. I package three or of these together and then ask to be upgraded to First Class in exchange of one of these 60+ year old memento of the airline. Worked both ways on my two trips to Europe last year and one way to Florida this year. First class was full on the return trip so could not upgrade.
*** I always give people a "Thank You" card when I get even the slightest bit of good service. I ALWAYS enclose a $2 lotto ticket - they never forget you after that. Next time I am in I always get outstanding service!!!
*** The HR person at works collects spoons. I always bring two or three back from my trips for her. I now get anything I want....
Etc etc...
Peter Dielissen [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Fredericton, New Brunswick, Canada
Friday, June 06, 2003 at 12:57:59 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S!
OK, OK, here's my shrew story...
I had quite a menagerie of animals at 136 Geddes Street, Nkana-East. I can remember having a Vervet, a small burrowing owl, many tortoises, a bat, many mice and rats, silk moths, chameleons, a nagaapje (bushbaby to the Soutjes on the list), budgiregars, parrots, many different wild birds (chicks and adults), a baby puff adder, and probably quite a few other creatures I have forgotten about.
I had quite a reputation as being able to raise young animals deprived of their parents, or healing animals that were sick or injured. Many kids brought these creatures to me.
I had an idea of becoming a park ranger in the Federal parks system, or of becoming a veternarian.
I could NOT, however, heal the broken leg of a heron that Wendy Wadham brought me once. I suggested we return ito the marsh at the end of Geddes Street, down by the powerlines, were I explained to a gullible Wendy that "nature would take care of the heron". Yeah right, it probably became some other creatures dinner!
One christmas day I was prowling around the Kitwe Slimes Day (not the Uchi), and on the high end of the dam, I found under a piece of cardboard a whole family of shrews: mother and a litter still feeding from her breasts. I scooped them up and brought them home. I thought they were like mice, so I housed them with my family of white mice, who also had recently a little litter of babies as well. I showed the lot to my mum, who horrifiedly chased me out of her room! Women just have no heart!
Well, horrified, the next morning, I found the carnage in the cage. The shrews had devoured almost all of my mice. Only a straggling mother was left, battered, bleeding, and quite haggard. Alarmed, I rounded up the little shrew culprits, now somewhat weary to touch the little monsters, and I quickly took them back to their home under the cardboard on Kitwe Slimes Dam.
I don't like shrews---the animal OR human form!
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Friday, June 06, 2003 at 09:24:33 (UTC)
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Ali - that is not only funny but accurate.
The only time I had a close encounter with a shrew it WAS on the other foot.
In Kabulonga when I was growing up we inherited this weird cement swimming pool about four foot deep with steep steps at one end. During one of its empty times I was standing in it, bare foot. Why does a kid stand in an empty swimming pool? Because it's there of course. A shrew had got in and couldn't get out and I'm sure he was ravenous. There was my healthy pink big toe beckoning him like a big juicy worm and he shot over and gratefully buried his needle sharp little teeth in a manageable bit of it for a quick gnaw. His prospective lunch sent him sailing through the air with her life-giving blood fresh on his whiskers and promptly escaped. However I did leave him a plank to get out of the pool on.
Jilly, glad you enjoyed - talented as you are. By the way did you hear Van der Merwe and his family have taken their first steps of reprisal against Islamic terrorists? True! Yesterday this heroic family stormed a local kennel and captured all the Afghans. They report light casualties.
Tina Magee (née Wallace) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Texas, United States
Friday, June 06, 2003 at 03:49:24 (UTC)
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Heather
Lovely picture of the shrew - it has been my experience that animals like the shrew and the mole which have an exceedingly high metabolic rate and have to eat constantly or die, have such rich blood that it is most distasteful to most predators. We had a Siamese cat in England that used to sit for hours beside mole hills just to catch the mole and lay it on the ground in front of us.
I tried keeping a mole in an old bath full of earth, but having eaten all the worms in very quick time, it died - and only later when I was a bit older I realized that I had deprived it of the freedom it needs to feed almost non-stop. Another mole I caught when out on a long cycle ride from boarding school died on the way back to school - once again I did not realize that it would die from hunger so quickly. No doubt there was trauma too, but I am sure now that in both cases hunger was the reason for their sad demise.
Here in South China I have noted the same frenetic feeding behaviour of shrews and it is not uncommon to find them dead beside the road or a path, but completely untouched by whatever predator took an initial fancy to it. I have no experience of how snakes deal with shrews, but if snakes too give them a miss, then that will certainly be 'The Saving of the Shrew'
Wasn't it Shakespeare who tried to tame one.? I seem to recall from the film version with Richard Burton and Elizabeth Taylor - the Shrew was very difficult to tame.
Whilst talking about snakes - I have recently found a rarely seen snake - the Chinee Mountain Snake - Sibynophis chinensis chinensis (Gunter 1989) It was lying very still beside my Hilux and surprisingly did not move until I picked it up. In all my 38 years in HK I have only seen one of thee before. They are non-venomous and eat skinks [those smooth scaled lizards].
I have it in a tank on sand with a pot of water and will try it out on geckos [chit chats] before photographing & releasing it in the garden. It's too small to eat a shrew, and shrews are hard to find let alone catch.
What was the web-site on which you found the photo of the shrew Heather ?
Cheers Ron
Ron Clibborn-Dyer [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Hong Kong SAR, China
Friday, June 06, 2003 at 01:25:45 (UTC)
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Jilly, Tina.........you have heard of "the taming of the Shrew".......well this time the shrew is on the other foot.......giggles........Heather what a beautiful pic......the little guy reminds me sort of the little marsupials here.....eg the pygmy possum.........Thanks again for your wonderful photos.
Ali
Ali Key [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Perth, Australia
Friday, June 06, 2003 at 01:02:33 (UTC)
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Tina,
Wow! That must be something to do with it - that's probably why Heather managed to save her shrew from the cats - they (the shrews) definitely seem to exude something that totally repels kitty cats anyway.
Most interesting, thank you - oh - and by the way - your poem was stunning! Wish I could that sort of thing! I must try harder!
Jilly
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 23:19:09 (UTC)
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Jill and Ali
I know there are a couple of shrews that have toxins in their saliva. So got interested in this subject. At least one of the former type is in North America. But having followed up on that - I haven't found any toxic ones in Africa.
However with the African Elephant Shrew I read that: "Tubular glands along with the nasolacrimal and lateral nasal gland ducts release secretions on the tip of the bare rostrum that may inhibit the chemical defenses of ants and termites".
Could be that this defense works on cats too.
Tina Magee (née Wallace) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Texas, United States
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 21:57:29 (UTC)
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Dave
Thank you for your timely message. You obviously noticed that I had forgotten to jot down the names of the church, the cafe and the hofje.
We had some of the film developed yesterday including one of you by the canal. It was a good shot and I shall e-mail it to you together with pictures of the Westertoren and the boat.
Tot ziens.
Chisanga.
Chisanga Puta-Chekwe [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 21:04:44 (UTC)
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Chisanga !
Enjoyed our time spent in Amsterdam! You are welcome back anytime, mate! By the way, the "brown bar" we hung out in is called Café van Zuylen for future refererence and it sits on the Singel at the Torensluis. And the hofje I showed you is off the Eerste Leliedwarsstraat in the Jordaan. The church you photographed is the Westertoren or Westerkirk, and remember, once out of site, you are NOT in Amsterdam! (Remember my little trivia about that?)
The gold-crowned dome was an honour only a few churches were allowed to display, and was awarded by the Emperor Maximilian.
Hope your trip back was comfortable. It is never enjoyable, is it?
I am off to LA on 9 July to see Dad and Mum. I return to Oud Mokum on 9 August to take up the terrible slog of living in Old Europe... [Kansanshi ear-to-ear grin here]
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dawie van der Bliksem
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 20:35:05 (UTC)
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I tried for some self control and lasted nearly 24 hours but I'm happy to say lost the battle.....
Douggie G - Forget the reality - just return to the romance of the moment.
Ode To A Tassel Tosser
Sweet "bird" of youth
How fondly I remember
The curves whereon
I fixed my boyhood gaze.
That jiggly flesh
I never got my hands on.
My mouth goes dry
In memory my eyes glaze.
Those many nights
I watched those flying tassels
My fingers itching
Sweaty - palm and heel.
I should have braved
The pain and obvious hassle
To cop a grab
And hear the outraged squeal.
And as I hit the night air
And the darkness,
The bouncer rudely
Signing off my fate.
Perhaps I'd KNOW -
Have written in Life's Manual
How she got those puppies
To counter-rotate.
Tina Magee (née Wallace) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Texas, United States
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 20:05:15 (UTC)
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Heather,
That Elephant Shrew pic is gorgeous! Tjose crumpled ears! - I have found that my cats find shrews distasteful - they sort of think they are mice and then spit them out. I wonder why? Any ideas, Alix?? Maybe it's because they are carnivorous?
That's a lovely pampoen, too! Tasty, very tasty.
Kathy Barnett - GET WELL SOON!
Jilly
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 19:41:45 (UTC)
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Chris,
When were all these white people summarily deported via Chirundu?
We arrived in Zambia in 1965 - my (white) Dad was employed by the Zambian Army, so maybe I missed something beacuse we were 'part' of the government?
Jill
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 19:37:58 (UTC)
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Bill and Johnny,
If Pamela the tassel tosser is still around and tries to perform her old tricks she will probably bruise her ankles.
Cheers - Doug
Doug Grewar [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vryheid, Natal, South Africa
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 18:33:25 (UTC)
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Zumla, quoting direct
A> "I do not recall the Kaunda regime encouraging a White Exodus."
and
B>" Whatever your views on Kaunda..he had his principles and one of them was his total opposition to racism"
A> Your head must have been in the sand. White folk were summarily deported and escorted to Chirundu. All levels other than top executives. Northern Rhodesian born or former Federal citizens, made no difference. It made life in the business world extremely difficult. The Labor department rules created chaos.
B> KK was a full on racist, tearfully going after whites and Asians, waving his hanky. He was also a full on idiot who should be brought to justice for bringing on the demise of the Zambian economy (and yes, that includes Zambia Airways).
Enough. I know people here do not like to discuss these issues here, and I will not pursue this any further.
Chris Tamm [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Hilo, Hawaii, United States
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 18:11:06 (UTC)
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Ayub,
I have just returned from Holland where I was attending a nephew's wedding as well as meeting the founder of the GNR. I have not had a chance over the past week to check the postings.
You are broadly right about Mr. Kaunda's opposition to racism. I think the Zambianisation policy with respect to trading licences was motivated by a desire to increase Zambian participation in the economy. I do not think this was necessarily Kaunda's way of reducing Asian influence.
In fact I have an Asian-Zambian friend who takes every opportunity to remind me that his business grew as a result of the Zambianisation policy. As a Zambian, my friend was able to acquire a number of businesses previously owned by foreigners.
Without dismissing the important role played by politicians, I attribute Zambia's stability to the people's temperament and the existence of the Copperbelt.
For some reason Zambia's major ethnic groups value negotiation and even compromise, over conflict. These groups have lived together on the industrial Copperbelt and adopted one local language as the lingua franca of the area. It was the Copperbelt that saw the first wave of inter-ethnic marriages. This fact alone has contributed to acceptance (not just tolerance) of ethnic diversity. Nowadays Lusaka is becoming more like the Copperbelt in terms of ethnic diversity.
It is also interesting that Zambians of the pink variety are descended mostly from people who were either escaping intolerance in Europe or South Africa. Simon Zukas' excellent biography, published a couple of months ago, has an interesting account of how his family escaped anti semitism first in Europe and then in SA. While in SA the Zukas family was advised to consider Northern Rhodesia because "there is no anti semitism there".
As an aside, it is interesting that white Zambians are as disturbed by the influx of white South African "investors" into their country as are their black compatriots.
I have had the privilege of studying Zambia both from a local and international point of view. My hope is that we shall all realise that Zambia only makes sense when all its constituent parts work together. Zambia is not just Bemba, Lozi, Ngoni or Tonga. It is all these groups; it is all Zambians of Asian origin; all Zambians of European origin; all Zambians of South African origins; all indegenous groups and all in betweens.
Chisanga.
Chisanga Puta-Chekwe [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 17:53:08 (UTC)
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NORTHERNERS
Earlier today I was looking for something on the web and came across a list of mammals found in the Luangwa Valley. One of them was the four-toed elephant shrew. Here is a photo of one which my cats dragged in a couple of months ago - quite cute little animals and at least this one, we managed to save.
CRAIG
Do you remember the flat white boer pampoen now?
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 16:44:28 (UTC)
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Northerners
Just in case you are planning to visit Zambia - I have just received a press release in to say that with effect from 4 June 2003, Australians,Canadians and New Zealanders now require visas to visit Zambia. I don't have details of costs etc, but it will probably be the equivalent of whatever those countries charge us for visas.
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 16:07:47 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S!
Some days ago we talked a little about Mickie Most, so influential with a lot of us lads in Northern Rhodesia days... well did I EVER find a jewell (along with a few others as well) at Saturn (touted as the world's largest CD shop) in Köln... for music fans and devotées like myself, this is beaut: THE YARDBIRDS ULTIMATE!
A two-CD set with EVERYTHING. It is divided into four sections: The Giogrio Gomelsky Era, the Simon Napier-Bell Era, the Peter Grant Era, and the Keith Relf Solo Recordings. Mickie Most was the producer during the Peter Grant Era, you might remember the international hit of that era as "Little Games".
"over, under, sideways, down" is blaring onto Amsterdam's hot summery afternoon Singel canal as we speak...
Keep on rockin'!
Dave Cooper
Founder - GNR
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 13:11:34 (UTC)
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Gordon,
I don't know of any buddy or relation of mine who used to write on this board 18 months ago. I don't subscribe to views like "Rhodie farmers had it coming". I find views like that totally reprehensible. I believe that the world is a place for all to live in regardless of your race, religion or cultural background. I also find the Mugabe situation totally unacceptable. What I always have said is that the UK Government continues to do business with that country till today! At the same time you get Peter Hain ( government Minister) encouraging others to cut sporting links with that country. Cutting business links with it would bring to an end this miserable chapter quicker than cutting sporting links.
Chris,
I do not recall the Kaunda regime encouraging a White Exodus. The first minority to be affected drastically was the Asian Community. In 1968 the Government passed legislation that banned any non-Zambian from trading. This was specifically aimed at the Asian community since they ran over 80% of the Retail/wholesale Sector. Instead to leaving the UK, many of the Asian community applied for Zambian Citizenship, rode the storm and stayed behind. They still managed to run most of the Retail Sector. The Businessmen who made a killing from Zambia in the 1960's and 70's were predominantely White..do I need to name some?..Tiny Rowlands..Sardines...I could go on...
Whatever your views on Kaunda..he had his principles and one of them was his total opposition to racism. Zambia is one of the few African countries that has escaped military intervention or large -scale disorder. I think one must thank Kaunda for that...he brought some form of political stability which has continued till today.
As for the incidents of armed robberies..I too have lost three relatives in the past three years in Lusaka (and a number of friends too) because of the same reason. But then I also lost a taxi driver friend a few months ago in Bolton, Gtr. Manchester who was savagely attacked by two racist passengers. He left behind a young wife and two kids. Racist attacks on Asian taxi drivers are a common occurence in the UK. When the world degenerates to this level..where a man is attacked purely because of his colour or religious background..and no other reason ..then we all need to do something about it. I know Stephen Lawrence's parents still look for justice after their son was killed for the same reason. This same sickening attitude has now spread to the USA where many Muslim women ( who have nothing whatsoever to do with 9/11) who wear scarves are being taunted and spat at. Do you want them to leave the States or should they not try and fight their corner? This is what made people like Wilberforce, Martin Luther King, Mandela, Gandhi etc so great. If they would have taken your advice they would have left their country of residence..and let things be. You should not live in the past. Look ahead and ensure that these attitudes do not resurface. There are always going to be idiots who will subscribe to outdated attitudes. It is our duty to make sure they do not succeed. My main point was to bring to the attention of subscribers that what they go through in Southern Africa..happens here too! As for Saudi Arabia..I can assure you that crime is on the increase there too. Especially drug-related. So there is no escaping..cheer up Chris!!
Ayub Ismail Zumla [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Manchester, United Kingdom
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 12:01:50 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S!
I will be visiting my dear Dad, Mum and my sisters in the southern Californian region of the USA on 9 July to 9 August.
I will also be visiting friends in The People's Republic of San Francisco during that period.
I am attempting to surprise my parents. Some of you have their telephone number. Please do not phone them until I am there. I want this to be a surprise. This is an important time for me and my National Hero Father, who is now suffering from alzheimer's.
If you would like to get together or try to, give me a ping or a ring.
Tot straks...
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper
Founder of the GNR
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 11:53:05 (UTC)
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If I could lay hands on that Tassel Tosser I would not be sharing her with you Billy, and as for having a stroke I would be all for that, I wonder where the dear girl is today, I dont know if our own Pole Dancer is going or not I hope for the sake of Billy and Charles that she is, as she is something to see when she gets into top gear,I only wish I was going to get there but with a 14 million to one chance of winning the lottery I can only pray. regards Johnny.
Johnny [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Scarborough, United Kingdom
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 06:56:28 (UTC)
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Vee Dench
Happy Birthday
June Bohl
Am I not correct in saying that today is your birthday as well???
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 06:54:02 (UTC)
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Hi all....
We live in such a crazy world, violence and hatred abounds...but......lucky for us we have a place where we can roam and write our thoughts, or silently trapse along without leaving any footsteps (the lurkers )in peace, have a laugh, a cry, or just dream of our beloved Africa..... this is a place where there is no need for venting our hatred towards one another.......when people have their own agendas and cause friction....I think of those less fortunate than us..........
"If nature has ever attempted to build an indestructable creature, it would be the northern white rhino, A beast so strong and so powerful that it is essentially a battle tank with hooves and, as such, is impervious to harm from even the most determined and capable African carnivores. In truth its heavily armoured hide is virtually bulletproof - but not quite. Which is why it is now all but extinct.....
The enduring legacy of this mighty animal is utterly tragic. Merely a few bottles of powdered horn sold by criminals for immense profit to pathetic men who foolishly think that this substance can revive their wilting manhood....
Imagine that
An entire species reduced to a handful of dust.....
Ali
Ali Key [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Perth, Australia
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 01:50:18 (UTC)
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In Memory of Barrie Braidford's Dad - June 5th 1953
"Life is as fleeting as a rainbow, a flash of lightning, a star at dawn."
"If we could see the miracle of a single flower clearly,
our whole life would change"
"We inter-breathe with the rain forests, we drink from the oceans.
They are part of our own body."
"If you wish to know the divine, feel the wind on your face
and the warm sun on your hand."
[From Buddha's little instruction book. by Jack Kornfield.]
The Rainbow Bridge
Just this side of the Jade Kingdom is a place called Rainbow Bridge.
Upon the death of a person who has been especially close to you, they
travel to the Rainbow Bridge. There are meadows and hills for all their
friends so that they can live happily together. There is plenty of food,
water and sunshine, and they are warm and comfortable. All who have been
ill and old are restored to health and vigor; everyone who goes there is
made whole and strong again; they are all returned to the state in which
you wish to remember them.
They are happy and content, with one exception:
They have never forgotten you, who loved them and whom they left behind.
They all live happily together, but the day comes when one suddenly stops
and looks into the distance. The clear eyes are intent. Suddenly they
break away from the group, running over the green grass, their strong legs
carrying them faster and faster.
YOU have been seen, and when you finally meet, you cling together in joyous
reunion, never to be parted again.
Happy kisses rain upon your face, your arms again hold each other, and you
look once more into the loving face, so long gone from your life, but never
absent from your heart.
Then you cross the Rainbow Bridge together................
Always Remember - No Deadlines = No Stress = No Hassle = No Worries.
Life is to be enjoyed - We only Pass This Way But Once.
Gather ye rosebuds while ye may,
Old Times is still a-flying;
And this same flower that smiles today,
Tomorrow will be dying.
Robert Herrick (To the Virgins to Make Much of Time)
Let your life lightly dance on the edges of Time
like dew on the tip of a leaf.
- Tagore
If the sight of the blue skies fills you with joy,
if a blade of grass springing up in the fields has power to move you,
if the simple things of nature have a message that you understand,
rejoice, for your soul is alive..."
(Italian Actress; 1859-1924) - Eleonora Duse
Your living is determined not so much by what life brings to you
as by what you bring to life.
- John Homer Miller
Live not one's life as though one had a thousand years,
but live each day as the last.
- Marcus Aurelius Antoninus
The true meaning of life is to plant trees,
under whose shade you do not expect to sit.
- Nelson Henderson
"I shall pass through this world but once.
Any good therefore that I can do
or any kindness that I can show to any human being,
let me do it now.
Let me not defer or neglect it.
For I shall not pass this way again."
(1773-1855 - French-born Quaker Minister)
~ Steven Grellet
Moments
Your life's but a moment, a moment, no more
When this second is gone, it will pass through a door
Through the door is your past, to a space in your mind
To a library of sorts, but no books there to bind
Your future is a dream, something unknown
It does not exist, and cannot be shown
The future is the place where you alter the past
A past that you wanted, wanted to last
We spend much of our lives ignoring today
Wishing tomorrow could be like yesterday
The true past is unchanging no matter what’s said
It can only be altered inside of your head
The future, the past, they lack all your senses
The future, the past, separated by fences
Today is the place upon which we glide
So live life to the fullest--enjoy the ride
By: Joseph.W.Bradley
Best Wishes, and Kind Regards,
Ron & Veronica Clibborn-Dyer
at the Temple of Hidden Peace & Tranquillity in Hong Kong, China
Barrie
We shall dedicate a Flame Tree or a Jacaranda in the Temple Garden to your Dad if you would like that.
Ron
_________________________________________________________________
Barrie Braidford wrote:
Hello to you all again,
Doug, sorry to hear of the passing of your father. That news and the subsequent messages of condolences from all over the world almost breached my emotional dam . It was certainly badly cracked and I really had to fight back the tears and stop myself going to pieces. As many of you who have been reading the message board over the last couple of years will know, my father died very suddenly, unexpectedly and I have to add mysteriously, on June 5th 1953 in Mulobezi N R.
He had taken us to Africa after the war, as he believed there was a much better future there for him and his family, Sadly he did not make it for very long. My poor mother woke up on that morning to find a hitherto very fit man, dead in bed beside her, she never got over the shock, and had a very difficult time bringing up my sister and myself without her partner, whom she never stopped loving, and talking about. We never have found out the cause of his death, it will forever remain one of lifes enigmas. Anyway spare him a thought as you go about your business on June 5th (The 50th anniversary of his passing).
He did his bit for Northern Rhodesia while he was there.
It is "hot " in the north of England at the moment, we reached the dizzy heights of 23 C yesterday
although two of my sons who are in Gran Canaria at the moment had 44 c a couple of days ago!! Bye Bye for now barribee.
Barrie Braidford
Newcastle upon Tyne, England
Friday, May 30, 2003 at 09:59:39 (UTC)
Ron Clibborn-Dyer [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Hong Kong SAR, China
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 00:57:11 (UTC)
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Northeners,
If in the land of the blind the one eyed man is king, would it be correct to assume that in the land of the Ostrich the eagled eyed Chicken Little (Tamm) is also King. I think so. Jill Aplin, my wifes sister's bosses wife was shot dead at a trafic light in JHB three weeks ago and my wifes father's German car mechanic was shot dead at a traffic light in Durban two weeks ago. Two people, directly connected to my family in Africa? What a coincedence! Chris, Turkeys and Ostriches have a lot in common. Heather, when I left your wonderful country in 1979 I paid the customs guy K200.00 for the "garrantee" that my few belongings would make it through customs and get onto a plane without problems. 200 kwacha then was 4 months wages for a garden attendant. I think beer at the time cost 35 ngwee a bottle (floaters where no extra charge)
yo yumlo, you had a buddy on these pages about 18 months ago who said that the Rhodie Farmers had it coming? Are you related to him? I think I might please you all and go the way of my bud Elias the bloody greek
Gordon Garlick [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Aberdeen, New Jersey, United States
Thursday, June 05, 2003 at 00:19:25 (UTC)
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Chris,
I have replied to you privately - but I have to say one thing, I am a reserve police officer (mounted - on horses - folks!) and I do not find crime levels acceptable - I merely stated that none of those things has ever happened to me - please don't misconstrue what I am saying.
Jill
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Wednesday, June 04, 2003 at 21:24:34 (UTC)
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Heather
Sorry to see that the Livingstone reunion is not getting the support you'd hoped for.
Just a thought - If Johnny Green was able to persuade Pamela the Tassle Tosser to give a swansong performance at the Zambezi Sun for the boys during the visit, you may boost the attendance figures somewhat!
On second thoughts, it might cause a few strokes among the aging Don Juans of Copperbelt yesteryears.
best regards.
Bill Hunt [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Widenham, Natal, South Africa
Wednesday, June 04, 2003 at 20:26:00 (UTC)
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Zumla,
There is absolutely no need to state the obvious. Everybody knows there is crime in most places (except for Saudi perhaps). If the crime level becomes unnacceptable to you, then you do something about it - like move on. But one can complain about all sorts of things. Dave Cooper found life in the US unnacceptable, and he moved on. Jill finds the crime level in JNB acceptable, and is happy to stay. So be it.
As far as my desparture from Zambia is concerned is of no importance to you, but it is not a secret, and was not a hurried up affair. I will say this though, when you were living in Zambia in the late sixties/early seventies, the government took every step to rid the country of all white people, those born in the country or otherwise, made no difference.
Chris Tamm [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Hilo, Hawaii, United States
Wednesday, June 04, 2003 at 20:22:40 (UTC)
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Chris,
My point is that crime exists everywhere. I have seen car hijackings and armed robberies in Zambia. Simple point ..it is now endemic in the UK too! And drug trafficking too! But one aspect I have never experienced in Zambia whenever I have been there are crude racial and religious slurs that are becoming too common here. Bet you have never experienced this anywhere. No point me or any other ethnic minority running away from the problem (ie. suggestion of leaving the UK) ..one has to fight it tooth and nail! After all we do live in a free society. Can't keep on kneeling to Blair and Company..especially now that we know that England have just selected him to play against Zimbabwe at cricket tomorrow! As their main "spinner". The word "spin" is now used in Parliament instead of what we in Zambia refer to as "bullshit"). Bet you must have left Zambia in a hurry for whatever reasons!! Now remember if the going gets tough..the tough fight back..or do we run! By the way Liverpool has just been named the Culture Capital of Europe....crime there is nearing Jo'berg propotions!! Log on to the "Liverpool Echo" on the net..you will see it all!
Ayub Ismail Zumla [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Manchester, United Kingdom
Wednesday, June 04, 2003 at 19:49:02 (UTC)
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Jill,
I merely responded to your "Cogitating and Ruminating" about the poor sign up to the event, and made a few inert observations as to (perhaps) the primary reason. Nobody came up with any other reason(s). Is this a case of killing the messenger?
Heather,
I am sorry that the sign up has not been better. I have arranged many Rhodesian Reunions in the Western US and know just how much time is spent in the organisation for such an event. It is mostly very rewarding when it comes off well (i.e. a good attendance), but tough when you have to struggle to pull it off. Been there, done that. I hope it comes off well.
As regards my reference to "bribes" at the Falls Bridge, it is well documented that entry/exit to Zim is troublesome to those who have never been there and/or who have not been there for a long time. It is also true that residents like yourself are fully in tune with local/regional conditions and behave in the right way/ say the right things at the right time in order not to be subjected to the sort of things "foreign" visitors can be.
BTW, to whomever said the Zambian side of the falls are better? Too troo! That Eastern Cataract is thee most magnificent part the chasm.
Chris Tamm [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Hilo, Hawaii, United States
Wednesday, June 04, 2003 at 18:49:21 (UTC)
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Hi I just want those people who organize the GNR
to know that I enjoy reading up on everythying N.Rhodesian. (Zambian) I think that Heather is doing a great job in co-ordinating all activities, and I would like to wish her the best of luck with her new venture in Livingstone.
Good luck Heather
Elizabeth Liversidge (née Rodgers) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Thornhill, Ontario, Canada
Wednesday, June 04, 2003 at 18:40:23 (UTC)
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I know that Chris Tamm is a favoured whipping boy around here, and he and I have certainly traded blows on several occasions. However, are the people that run this site the only ones who saw through Ayub's patently transparent baiting? With all due respect to our South African members who have been lucky enough to escape violent crime, I have to agree with Tamm's assessment that the crime statistics for a week in north west England could probably be bested in far less time in some parts of South Africa. Just in the last few months two close friends of my family (one in Jo'burg and another in Durban) were victims of violent crime. That said, my anecdotal evidence doesn't make a statistic -- I'll leave the research to you.
Ayub,
You may or may not be aware that there is a history to this message board that pre-dates your arrival by several years. Your most recent post was clearly an attempt to bait someone into a nasty fight. I respectfully ask that you think carefully before making a similar post in the future.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Wednesday, June 04, 2003 at 18:37:20 (UTC)
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I have just come home from work in the most terrible storm, trees and branches were falling down all round me considering I was in my little tiny car it was really quite scary.
I have to add to what Jill was saying about SA. We go back every year, having spent a month at christmas in Durban area, Cape Town and Joburg. I have to agree with Jill. Of course you have to be careful, but where in the world would you not have to be. We have had the cheapest and BEST holiday in years this year in SA. The people are trying really hard to make you welcome. The Hotels are great and they are really inexpensive.
If you was not moving this summer I would be there for the bash. I have attended different ones and they all have the same thing in common. We had a unique life in Rhodesia, and no one can take that away from us.
If we take the time to ignore the likes of Chris and concentrate on what we enjoy and the way we enjoy doing it he may even learn to be a bit more cheerful and sociable.
I used to think that Arthur our token moaning minny, but you have gone up in my estimation by 600% compared to Chris, Arthur you are one of the nicest guys on this site.
How come we have not heard from you lately!!!
Jill Main
Okay when are to sending pictures of the last bash, and also let us in on what went on there!!!! Or did you miss behave so badly that we are not allowed to hear about it.
Well folks bye for now and have a lovely night
Love Wilma
Wilma Wall (née Henry) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Almelo, Netherlands
Wednesday, June 04, 2003 at 17:25:46 (UTC)
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You can always rely on Chris Tam to be miserable! I am so glad that I never met him when he was in Zambia!
I live in Johannesburg and in 21 years I have never been hijacked, robbed, raped, had to pay bribes - even though I travel extensively by car throughout Southern Africa. Don't you ever worry about the world falling on your head in perfect little old Hawaii, Chris? For Pete's sake - get a life and stop being so anti everything African I am very happy and proud to live in Africa and I am heartily sick of your constant negative criticism.
In the famous words of Steve McGarrett in Hawaii 5 0 - "go get him, Danno".
Bye - and see you all at the Lark!
Jilly
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Wednesday, June 04, 2003 at 15:36:21 (UTC)
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Beatrice Sandler, Martin Penstone
Happy Birthday
Beth Lloyd
Remind me - which Coventry? I'll get hold of Vernon and Mike to see if they can get themselves into gear to do something more interesting than watching rugby on television. It might not be easy though!!
Let me know full details of your trip to UK. I need to get over there and am hoping to make it in July - have a hiccup with my passport at the moment - but if I get it in time, we might be able to meet up somewhere.
Chris Tamm
I note with interest that you mention bribes as one of the expenses to include. Having lived here for 43 years, and having travelled extensively in both Southern and East Africa, I have never yet been asked for a bribe nor have I ever paid one. Perhaps this is something that one only learns to do when one lives in the western world, so that one can complain about the corruption in Africa.
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Wednesday, June 04, 2003 at 12:40:38 (UTC)
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Anyone who is thinking of going to Livingstone, I have been speaking to a friend who has just come back from South Africa. Some friends of hers who are in the travel industry have just returned from Livingstone and Zambia in general. She says that the Falls is far superior on the Zambian side than it has ever been on the Zimbabwean side and that it is the best trip they've had for a long time. She says the hotels, the Livingstone Sun and the Royal Livingstone Hotel are out of this world. There was also a bit on the Falls on TV on Monday night and it really does look fabulous.
I realise it's expensive getting there but what an opportunity to have the holiday of a life time!
Chris Tam
Do you ever have anything positive to say about anything? I have read your postings in the past and in the last month or so and I must say you do seem to have a very gloomy, pesimistic outlook on life. Surely there must have been some good times for you in Zambia? Sadly most of us had to leave there, but there are good memories of the place too and they do seem to be making efforts to get back on track there, particularly the tourism industry. So lighten up a little and try using your obvious knowlege to encourage, not denigrate
Fiona Gayther (née Ferguson) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
United Kingdom
Wednesday, June 04, 2003 at 08:47:08 (UTC)
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Arthur
Sorry for the delay but thank you for posting the appie photo last month - Steve has no recollection of ever seeing that photo before. He had such a laugh remembering the event and the 'initiation', and all the other appie's in the photo. The timing of the picture surfacing in his life was also sort of neat - that was a picture of him as he started his career and in March he retired -crovers the spectrum of one's working life.
Dawie
It was so bizarre logging onto the message board on
Sunday morning and reading your posting re the passing of Mickie Most. At 8.30 a.m. on Sunday morning I was driving to White Rock and CISL 650 was playing Corrina Corrina and that song always reminds me of the Mickie Most band playing at the OB Bennett Hall in Kitwe. Later on in the day my brother in Cheshire phoned me and he also told me that he had read the orbituary in a local newspaper.
Jill/Heather
On June 6th 37 years ago Steve and I and our eldest son flew from Ndola enroute to Canada. On September 11 Steve and I and our youngest son and his wife will be flying to Zambia. We will spend two weeks in Zambia, and attend the reunion before heading through Botswana, Namibia and South AFrica. My experience has been that life cannot be measured in the cost of airfares, the price of a braai or whether A is a better deal than B. but something in your soul that says this is the right time to do what you are doing. It has taken us about six months to compare prices and make plans and suddenly it is as though every thing is falling into place.
In December 1898 my great grandmother and three small children arrived in Salisbury, Rhodesia. One of those small children was my grandmother. In 1998 several members of the family started organizing a family reunion to commemorate that event that was important to no one else but to our family. It was slated for Xmas 1998 and every single thing about it was impossible for us living in Canada. Neither Steve or I could get holidays at Xmas. Air fares are highest at Xmas. The list of obstacles went on forever. However due to several personal tragedies that occurred in 1998 in November - barely three weeks before the reunion the decision was made to throw caution and common sense and anything else to the wind and go. Just getting a flight almost did us in but we arrived in Harare in a thunderstorm on Xmas eve where a cousin and her husband met us and we followed them to Morondera - shortly after we crossed a low bridge on the road to the farm the bridge flooded but hey we arrived. The next day 78 of Great Grandma's descendents and their spouses and offspring celebrated Christmas on the farm - it was an awesome experience.
We spent ten hectic days in Zim visiting relatives and seeing places we had always wanted to see such as Inyanga and the Chinyoi Caves. The farm is gone now, and many of the people unfortunately , but for us at that time it was just the right thing to do.
Four months and counting.
Steven and Margaret de Lange (née (wife) Margaret Charles) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Langley, British Columbia, Canada
Wednesday, June 04, 2003 at 06:36:59 (UTC)
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Maeve (Byrne) and Alison (Brooks),
Am coming over from 2 July to 13th July - shall we try again to get together? Will be in London for the first few days. Please email me your phone numbers and I'll give you a ring when I get there.
Heather, am trying to get some friends together to join me in Livingstone - will book as soon as I get some definites. Did you get hold of the Arnolds, the Coventrys or the Cantlys? If they make it from Mazabuka, then I'll make it from S.A.
Luv,
Beth
Elspeth Lloyd (née Robertson) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Blairgowrie, Johannesburg, South Africa
Wednesday, June 04, 2003 at 06:04:57 (UTC)
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Zumla,
Clearly life in UK is just too much for you. I might suggest you pick up your mpasha and head off somewhere in the deep south, like Johannesburg. Your crime stats pale in comparison.
Jill
Part of the reason for the poor acceptance of the Livingstone Lark is cost. Just look at a few of the items -African Queen dinner cruise $77. Saturday Braai $35. Activities all seem around $100. Accommodation varies a little, but it seems that you may pay $100/person, or $175/room in the better locations. London/Lusaka at GBP515, plus the trip to London, plus the trip to Livingstone. And then you need food and beverage expense, local car rental, bribes at the Falls bridge when you cross into Zim. Etc. Etc. All of this is per person. A couple can spend a pretty penny on such a trip, and perhaps many people will do a cost comparison with other places before heading off to a place where they have been to before. If you were to compare Hawaii for example, then the Livingstone costs as indicated above are relatively steep. It is apparent, sadly, that Zambia maybe milking the visitors which, if true, will keep people like "us" away.
As a little useless information for you, we have been fortunate to visit Bali, Fiji, New Zealand, Thailand, and Samoa during the past 5 years or so. Nowhere have we needed to spend the kind of money as at the Livingstone Lark, and we haven't exactly been "backpacking" either.
I wish it were different
Chris Tamm [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Hilo, Hawaii, United States
Wednesday, June 04, 2003 at 03:21:35 (UTC)
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Just a comforting thought for those of you who are lucky enough to be living in Southern Africa. Here in the North West of England I recorded the following from press reports in one week alone:
8 murders, 16 shooting incidents, 15 armed robberies at Post Offices and banks, 4 arson attacks (including a grenade being thrown through a window), 8 attempted rapes, seven rapes....and in certain areas of Liverpool and Manchester one needs to lock their car doors..especially women drivers who are having their handbags stolen from their cars whilst waiting for the traffic lights to change! A recent amnesty for holders of illegal weapons realised 18,000 sorties..ranging from pistols to even machine guns!! And then there is the usual racist/religious abuse thrown at minorities who happen to pass white working class areas ..or at football grounds..or at shopping centres. You are lucky that the black Zambian working class never put you through the barrage of racial slur that minorites in the UK suffer; day in day out. I thought all this nonsense about race and religion was in the past. I can assure you it is getting pretty bad here..Certain Politicians both in the UK and USA are taking upon themselves to create the conditions for these things to thrive! Compared with some of this demented lot here, the indigenous Zambian is respectful, well-mannered and courteous. So let us take our hats to them! The mind boggles sometimes!
Ayub Ismail Zumla [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Manchester, United Kingdom
Tuesday, June 03, 2003 at 20:47:19 (UTC)
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Northerners,
I have been cogitating and ruminating on the fact that so many of you are not going to be able to make the Livingstone Lark. Most cite reasons of not enough money - for whatever reason.
So many made it to the Banbury Bash - and that wasn't even held at home - people flew in from far and wide. Indeed, I almost did too. And there was less than a year's notice of that bash (I am being very generous here). The Livingstone Lark has been on the cards for over two years, and 'nobody' can make it? I wonder if you all do really have that special tie with Northern Rhodesia/Zambia that you claim to have?
It must be very disappointing for Heather after all her hard work. For me it's very sad - I really miss Zambia and, even if nobody else goes, I am going - even though we are going through very fiscally challenged times at the moment. After all, we have had a long time to plan for this reunion - and I am sure that those who do make it will have a ball!
Had to say it. Jill
Jill Aplin [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
South Africa
Tuesday, June 03, 2003 at 19:15:18 (UTC)
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Shirley Eveleigh, June Dobson, Sharon Richards
Happy Birthday
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Tuesday, June 03, 2003 at 14:49:09 (UTC)
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Helooo My Darling Peeps
Just got back from the Muf reunion in Bury - say what thoose Mufites know how to party!!! No. I wish, the ole computer "died" on me - luckily for you guys (not) a very sweet little Moroccan mannie came and spoke to her (he really knows his stuff and I do have his mobile number in case anybody in the UK needs to know). Sorted -
Doug - Am so sorry to hear about your Dad. I shed a few tears - I never had the honour of meeting him but as you know, the GNR brings people together. ........
Uncle Johnny
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See you in July!!!!!! Which one first - Haig???????
Gill
Gill Main [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Aberdeen, Scotland
Monday, June 02, 2003 at 21:09:33 (UTC)
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Stephen Park
Happy Birthday
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Monday, June 02, 2003 at 07:09:07 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S!
I always have enjoyed my encounters with fellow countrymen that I have met from the Great North Road website.
This sunny, hot, summery afternoon in Amsterdam was spent enjoyably with Chisanga Puta-Chekwe from one of my favourite countries: Canada! Besides chatting about Africa in general: touching on Senegal, Guinea, Ghana to our own neighbourhoods of central and southern Africa, I also gave him a tour of the old Jordaan neighbourhood here in Amsterdam. There's a beautiful old hofje that I love to show to tourists...
It was 30 degrees in Oud Mokum today!
Tot straks...
Dave Cooper
Founder
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Sunday, June 01, 2003 at 16:47:45 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S !
In honour of Mickie Most, I am now playing CORINNA CORINNA very loud out of my apartment building onto central Amsterdam on this hot, steamy bloody day!
And if you are looking for Mickie Most records, I recommend Rock-in-Beat Studios out of Germany. Go to www.rockinbeat.de.
Corrina! Corrina! I luv ya true!
Keep on rockin'
Groetjes...
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Sunday, June 01, 2003 at 12:13:50 (UTC)
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N O R T H E R N E R S !
It is sad that Mickie Most has passed away. You might remember, Jack Galaun, that I posted considerable information about Mickie Most, including how to buy his albums, as well as a cover of one of his albums which showed a map of southern Africa as the background to him and his band members.
Music is a huge part of my life, and Mickie Most was part of that great interest from the very early days. Of course, for me, his greatest hit was "Corinna Corinna".
Mickie was involved in some major acts, such as the Yardbirds.
I have his work on CD now. It is easy to buy from my earlier instructions.
Tot straks...
Dave Cooper [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Amsterdam, Nederland
Sunday, June 01, 2003 at 09:56:07 (UTC)
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Hic!
With my recent discovery, I should be.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Sunday, June 01, 2003 at 08:32:44 (UTC)
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Anthony Sauri, Viv Adams, Morrice Doyle-Davidson, Len Rolfe, Eamon Coughlan
Happy Birthday
but why don't we ever see any of you on the message board?
Craig
Have you been drinking again??
Heather Chalcraft (née Bender) [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Lusaka, Zambia
Sunday, June 01, 2003 at 08:03:15 (UTC)
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That's weird. Didn't see your post here a few minutes ago Jack.
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Sunday, June 01, 2003 at 07:24:12 (UTC)
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OK, the fact that nobody has posted yet has me worried, as this is the first new month on the new server.
My e-mail is piling up. I will answer when I can. I am up to my eyeballs in legal crap right now, and it does tend to sap your will to live. :)
Craig Hartnett [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Sunday, June 01, 2003 at 07:23:16 (UTC)
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I read on T.V. last night, that Mickie Most had passed away after succumbing to cancer. He lived quite near to me in North London and I passed his house everyday on my way to work.
He became famous and successful for his producing talents and brought many well known artistes and groups to the fore.
How many however, remember his more humble days as leader of a rock group playing all over Southern Africa? He 'specialised' in the popular Buddy Holly numbers of the day. I heard him a couple of times at the C.S.C. as well as the 20th Century Cinema. I believe one member of his group, came from Ndola?
Jack Galaun [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
London, England
Sunday, June 01, 2003 at 07:10:08 (UTC)
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A NEW MONTH, A NEW MESSAGE BOARD
The message board is archived at 23:58 (GMT, aka UTC) on the last day of every month. This message is just a reminder that the messages from last month have not disappeared into the bit bucket. They can still be found in the archives. On the archives page you will find links to every message board since its inception.
Following are some tips and suggestions for using this message board and the rest of the site. These notes were last updated on March 17th, 2005.
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Considering each message board can get quite large, it can be quite a challenge to find a particular word or name, especially if you're sure that you saw that word or name somewhere before. There's a much easier way to search the page than scrolling through hundreds of messages until you're cross-eyed. On Windows-based computers, you can just hit Ctrl+F; in Internet Explorer a small search box will appear on top of the message board (assuming that you already have the message board open) and in Mozilla Firefox a search box will appear at the bottom of the browser window. Just type the word or words for which you are searching into the box, then hit the Enter key (in Internet Explorer) or follow the highlighting (in Firefox) to see where your browser stops as it searches for the word. Repeat as often as necessary to find all instances of your search term.
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Have fun!
The Great North Road -- Northern Rhodesians Worldwide [ Profile ] [ Contact ]
1st of the Month, 2003 at 00:00:00 (GMT, aka UTC)
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Important Notes:
- All posts to this message board are logged.
- You must log in with your user ID and password to post a message.
- Lost your password? Get it through the password-retrieval form.
- If you don't see your post after you have submitted it, try clicking your browser's reload or refresh button.
- Spam will be deleted immediately and the offending member suspended.
- The small images of the fish eagle's head are a clue that you will see a photograph if you click on it. Pictures will open in a new window.
- To have your pictures displayed on the message board, please read the submission instructions.
- The Great North Road is not responsible for and does not necessarily endorse the contents of messages posted here.
- You can read some more notes and helpful hints on the tips page.
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